If what Chidi said to Eleanor didn't make you cry, what is wrong with you?
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@maryjanewatson the Michael on earth stuff was more emotional I thought.
When season 6 first aired, I just knew it was going to end with BoJack either dead or in prison. As it turns out, he's a bit of both (he's actually in jail and he's basically dead to every single person he's been close with in the past). I also knew that Mr. Peanutbutter, Todd, and Princess Carolyn were going to be fine (did PC's relationship with Judah remind anyone of Peggy and Stan from Mad Men or was it just only me? What a great surprise! I happen to love them together very very very much and I'm incredibly happy at the idea of Princess Carolyn being with someone who actually respects her, loves her, understands how her job works and how important it is for her, and is always willing to go the extra mile for her), but I always worried the most about Diane. I've always felt very connected to her and I kind of hoped things worked out for her because that could mean that things will eventually work out for me as well. I was a little bit disappointed to find out that she's no longer with Guy because I also wanted her to be with someone who truly loves her and cares for her, but then I remembered what Sonny said to her a couple of episodes ago about Guy always choosing "broken women" whom he then "fixes" and who eventually leave him when they're better, and I realized this: maybe that's why Diane is no longer with Guy. She is not "broken" anymore. And her final scene, in which she cuts off BoJack from her life for good, is further proof that she is, in fact, alright.
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@carolinaoftarth she married him though. They are still together.
This is getting harder and harder to watch.
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@gloom8 I’m worried about where this is heading.
the dog :( so sad... Not necessary at all!!
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@ahmedhamdy90 it might be necessary. It shows that James has changed/is changing as 8 episodes ago he would have had no problem putting it down but now he couldn’t do it.
I’m @vicquelly thanks I also removed mine
I mean, one of the shots during the intro song shows a woman going down some stairs in a period dress wearing the bracelet Roger gave Brianna. So there's not much of a question whether she'll be able to travel through the stones. Way to spoil the show, intro! LOL
I'm still so pumped, though! Can't wait!
(I've decided not to read the books so I can enjoy the show without it being clouded by all the stuff the screenwriters changed or omitted. Maybe I'll read them once the show is finished to see how they compare to each other).
One thing I'm kinda confused about. The Cherokee grandma basically told Claire she'd grow old enough for all of her hair to turn white, which made me think she was gonna live a longo, long time. But then, Roger's friend had that paper that said she and Jamie died in a fire no many years after the got their land. What's up with that? Can someone explain?
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@abtr if someone explains that’s more spoilers :person_shrugging_tone1::male_sign:
They don’t die in a fire but the house burns down. I can’t remember properly because I read the books a while ago but I think Jamie is working as a printer at the time and they don’t know if they’ve changed history or not so they still print the article so it appears in the future. Something like that. I think. I can’t remember.
Annie, I'm a hawk.
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@vhgauto haha was about to comment that exact line.
Review by Andrew Bloom
VIP9Very tempted to give this something less than a 10 because it doesn't have the heart of the greatest Futurama episodes (so perhaps consider this a 9.5), but my god is this episode both hilarious and brilliant as a parodic love letter to all things Star Trek. I love how game the actors from the original series were to poke fun at themselves and their show. (Shatner especially and surprisingly.) There were so many great Trek-related gags, and a lot of fun humor apart from those references as well (Fry's caterpillar escapade and inability to understand the life support/engines problems were both classic.) A ridiculously fun, creative, and laugh-worthy episode.
EDIT 12/6/2017: I loved this episode before I watched all of Original Series films and movie, and I love it even more now. While I knew most of the references by osmosis, it's even more enjoyable getting the subtler, direct references like snippets of dialogue pulled from the show, or the Church of Trek noting that the "Christine Chapel" is closed, or a giant green hand plucking our heroes from space. Plus, seeing the way the episode plays with the tropes of the show is even more outstanding having witnessed them firsthand. Bits like Kirk ripping his shirt, or the desert rocks setting, or the "Metamorphosis"-like energy being are all just outstanding. The comedy still lands perfectly, the story still moves at a great clip, and the interplay between the former castmembers is even better. Definitely one of my favorite episodes.
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@andrewbloom but if you’ve never seen any Star Trek this episode is very meh ♂️
I'm a sucker for the whole Groundhog Day routine —and for redheads —, so I had to watch this. I was disappointed by both. The characters are annoyingly pretentious, Nadia is too much of a dick to be likeable and, worst of all, it isn't even slightly funny.
But now I have to watch the whole thing because I really want to know what will happen to Oatmeal. FML(But not everything was meh, at least they ended the episode with one of my favourite Light Asylum songs.)
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@misnomer I hope so. I struggled with episode one. But the stairs bit made me laugh out loud when I was watching on a crowded train, I thought the timing was perfect and gag was spot on. Her line about trying to get down the stairs was the bit that made me lol. Not so much the “physical” comedy.
Shout by melkiades96
At one point I got bored. The scene where she falls off the stairs again and again, it seemed like sloppy writing to me. They could have come up with more creative and realistic ways that she could have died.
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@melkiades96 it was comedy, and a quite good concise comedy bit.
I'm a sucker for the whole Groundhog Day routine —and for redheads —, so I had to watch this. I was disappointed by both. The characters are annoyingly pretentious, Nadia is too much of a dick to be likeable and, worst of all, it isn't even slightly funny.
But now I have to watch the whole thing because I really want to know what will happen to Oatmeal. FML(But not everything was meh, at least they ended the episode with one of my favourite Light Asylum songs.)
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@misnomer the stairs scene/s in the next episode were quite hilarious.
Janet was brilliant at playing everyone except for Chidi.
So now we know why nobody gets into the good place. Yet another new plot wall they're rushing to tear down; these writers rip through plots with such alacrity, as if they're starving dogs chowing down. Don't know if I should admire or condemn them for it.
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@dewdropvelvet I thought her chidi was very well done. The way he pauses in his speech and stresses certain words really came though and she did it so well.
Well, clearly the 200 year old baby is Briana. Duh. I wonder if Jamie will get to go to the future with Claire to try and save his daughter. I'm excited about all the time traveling that is to come! I hope all the time lines don't get tangled up and confusing.
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@nightshadee yes they can. But Jamie won’t.
This show just gets more and more stupid with each passing week. It would take too long to list everything, so I'll just mention my one favorite macro and one favorite micro issue: (a) The ex-SECDEF thinks that just disappearing -- when a rock is heading our way that could potentially kill all of humanity -- is the best way to "protect" himself and his husband. And he's allowed to just drive off despite it being painfully obvious that he has critical information that would be good to know. That's a double dose of stupid right there. (b) Elon Musk Jr.'s text messaging app does not include timestamps. Someone probably should have been supervising the high school intern who was in charge of that visual.
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@jimgysin also the room that displays all the graphics of where asteroid will hit has glass walls. Everyone can see it! Thought it was a big secret!
Shout by Lucas Melo
VIP8Designated Survivor is great and enjoyable because of the people involved in it... but also increasingly predictable. They have this structure of:
- "Kirkman is dealing with this situation today"
- "Situation goes terribly bad, there's a dilemma, decisions to be made"
- "Kirkman saves the day"
- And meanwhile, "Agent Wells investigates"
I like the show because I love to see Kiefer Sutherland and the supporting cast has been wonderful as well, and it's been a "feel good" show, really - even when the outcome of Kirkman's problems is not that great, there is still a positive message being shared. And what can I say about Lyor's scenes, always on point. However, I fear that without innovation the show doesn't have much of a future, especially with the investigation stuff not being that interesting. We'll see what happens.
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@playsonic2 yes, it’s getting too predictable. I knew the people in the space station would be ok. I wish I didn’t know andnit was more suspenseful.
Review by Andrew Bloom
VIP9[9.8/10] It seems like every season, there’s one episode of BoJack Horseman that just floors me, and this may be the best of them all. More than BoJack’s dream sequence in S1, more than his unforgivable act at the end of S2, more than the even the harrowing end for Sarah Lynn in S3, “Time’s Arrow” is a creative, tightly-written, absolutely devastating episode of television that is the crown jewel of Season 4 and possibly the series.
The inventiveness of the structure alone sets the episode apart. It feels of a piece with the likes of Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind for finding outside the box ways to communicate the idea of dementia and the brain purging and combining and reconstructing dreams and memories into one barely-comprehensible stew. The way that the episode jumps back and forth through time is a superb way to convey the way this story is jumbled up and hard to keep a foothold on for Beatrice.
And that doesn’t even take into account the other amazing visual ways the show communicates the difficulty and incoherence or what Beatrice is experiencing. The way random people lack features or have scratched out faces, the way her mother is depicted only in silhouette with the outline of that scar, the way the images stop and start or blur together at emotional moments all serve to enhance and deepen the experience.
What’s even more impressive is how “Time’s Arrow” tells a story that begins in Beatrice’s youth and ends in the present day, without ever feeling rushed or full of shortcuts. Every event matters, each is a piece of the whole, from a childhood run-in with scarlet fever to her coming out party to an argument about the maid, that convincingly accounts for how the joyful, smart young girl we meet in the Sugarman home turns into the bitter husk of a woman BoJack is putting in a home. It’s an origin story for Beatrice, and a convincing one, but also one of the parental trauma that has filtered its way down from BoJack’s grandparents all the way down to poor Hollyhock.
And my god, the psychological depth of this one! I rag on the show a decent amount for writing its pop psychology on the screen, but holy cow, the layers and layers of dysfunction and reaction and cause and effect here are just staggering. The impact of Beatrice’s father’s cajoling and her mother’s lobotomy on her development as a woman in a society that tried to force her into a role she didn’t want or necessarily fit is striking in where its tendrils reach throughout her development. The idea of rebelling against that, and the way BoJack’s dad fits into that part of her life is incredible. And the story of growing resentment over the years from a couple who once loved each other, or at least imagined they did and then found the reality different than the fantasy is striking and sad.
But that all pales in comparison in how it all of these events come together to explain Beatrice’s fraught, to say the least, relationship to motherhood and children. The climax of the episode, which intersperses scenes of the purging that happens when Beatrice contracts scarlet fever as a child, her giving birth to BoJack, and her helping her husband’s mistress give birth all add up to this complex, harrowing view of what being a mom, what having a child, amounts to in Beatrice’s eyes.
The baby doll that burns in the fire in her childhood room is an end of innocence, a gripping image that ties into Beatrice’s mother’s grief over Crackerjack’s demise and whether and how it’s acceptable to react to such a trauma. The birth of BoJack, for Beatrice, stands as the event that ruined her life. BoJack is forced to absorb the resentments that stem from Beatrice’s pregnancy being the thing that effectively (and societally) forced her to marry BoJack’s father, sending her into a loveless marriage and a life she doesn’t want all because of one night of rebellion she now bitterly regrets. For her, BoJack is an emblem of the life she never got to lead, and he unfairly suffers her abuses because of it, just like Beatrice suffered her own parents’ abuses.
Then there’s the jaw-dropping revelation that Hollyhock is not BoJack’s daughter, but rather, his sister. As telegraphed as Princess Carolyn’s life falling apart felt, this one caught me completely off-guard and it’s a startling, but powerful revelation that fits everything we know so well and yet completely changes the game. It provides the third prong of this pitchfork, the one where Beatrice is forced to help Henrietta, the woman who slept with her husband, avoid the mistake that she herself made, and in the process, tear a baby away from a mother who desperately wants to hold it. It is the culmination of so many inherited and passed down traumas and abuses, the kindness and cruelty unleashed on so many the same way it was unleashed on her, painted in a harrowing phantasmagoria of events through Beatrice’s life.
And yet, in the end, even though BoJack doesn’t know or understand these things, he cannot simply condemn his mother to suffer even if he’s understandably incapable of making peace with her. Such a horrifying series of images and events ends with an act of kindness. BoJack doesn’t understand the cycle of abuse that his mom is as much a part of as he is, but he has enough decency, enough kindness in him to leave Beatrice wrapped in a happy memory.
Like she asked his father to do, like she asked her six-year-old son to do, BoJack tells her a story. It’s a story of a warm, familiar place, of a loving family, of the simple pleasures of home and youth that began to evaporate the moment her brother didn’t return from the war. It’s BoJack’s strongest, possibly final, gift to his mother, to save her from the hellscape of her own mind and return her to that place of peace and tranquility.
More than ever, we understand the forces that conspired to make BoJack the damaged person he is today. It’s just the latest psychological casualty in a war that’s been unwittingly waged by different people across decades. But for such a difficult episode to watch and confront, it ends on a note of hope, that even with all that’s happened, BoJack has the spark of that young, happy girl who sat in her room and read stories, and gives his mother a small piece of kindness to carry with her. There stands BoJack, an individual often failing but at least trying to be better, and out there is Hollyhock, a sweet young woman, who represent the idea that maybe, just as this cycle was built up bit-by-bit, so too may it be dismantled, until that underlying sweetness is all that’s left.
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@andrewbloom agreed. Don’t always agree with your reviews but hugely appreciate them and the thought you put in. I’m beginning to agree more and more as well.
