This actually is an overall decent finale. The tense in Camina's fleet is good. The Rocinante battle is good. Naomi's rescue is good. The reveal on the end was also good. However there's one reason that makes the episode feels like a jumble of choppily edited scenes: everything involving Alex's death.
I don't take issue with it being sudden and abrupt, as many deaths are. But everyone feels really disconnected from that one incident that should have affected at least all the main casts. Alex just died, but Holden and Naomi spent their time to listen to Naomi's supposed farewell (and spent minutes on it). Amos was more eager to bring Peaches instead of mourning his close friend; even worse he was only informed about Alex's death off screen. For a fellow Martian and somebody who has spent quite a time with Alex, Bobbie seems largely unaffected at all. And Alex, well... The only tribute they gave to this incident is a plaque, which makes for some emotional moment, but that's it. Heck, that part where Holden talked to Naomi to rekindle the events almost feels like Holden breaking the fourth wall to explain to viewers due to how abrupt it is handled.
It almost feels like the event is not supposed to happen, and the showrunners edited in last minutes.
This season has been nothing but a Naomi season that leads to a reunion of Rocinante crew. That incident stuck like a sore thumb, making the supposedly joyful event with all crews gathering feels really emotionally detached. Not to mention that, barring the reveal at the end, most events still happen off screen. Just like most things that happened this season. We don't get to see the impact of something big happening.
So despite being an overall decent episode, this finale closes the relatively most mediocre season The Expanse has produced. I'd even say that the quality is even lower than Season 4. The first four episodes were nice, but it went downhill and stagnated really fast.
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@dtsouza I watched the season knowing Cas Anvar's scandal. That's why it makes the episode feels even more extremely awkward. Alex's death itself is forcefully edited in that it's not immediately clear that he died from a stroke (so much they need Holden to explain it to the viewers in the next scene). Many have come to defend his abrupt death by mentioning the beeping monitor, but we don't even see the monitor with three dots on the brain except for the very last moments at a glance and very briefly in the start.
I'm aware of that interpretation of the scene you mentioned, but it just didn't work out for me. It only became beautiful for the viewers due to us knowing Cas' scandal, but is not as meaningful for the Rocinante crews themselves. They were still talking about their own (Naomi & Holden) relationship, in the end.
Especially because prior playing Naomi's recording, when they did talk about Alex it was Holden explaining to the viewers how Alex died. That dialogue was really bad. Not to mention that the dialogue was supposed to be Holden explaining Fred's death to Naomi, making it even worse, especially for The Expanse standard.
No joke, this single episode is the best Star Wars I've seen since the throne room sequence in Return of the Jedi. I can't think of anything else that comes close except maybe the ending of Rogue One.
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@triseult if this is the best Star Wars you've seen, you haven't seen much. Try Knights of the Old Republic, Republic Commando, Jedi Knights, Dark Forces.
I'm beginning to think the writing team only had three good episodes in them. Getting predictable and drawn out.
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@jim222001 I'll help you out: next episode will be another filler and the season ends with a cliffhanger after everyone gangs on The Mando. Who the heck Baby Yoda is, why is he wanted, what the Imperial remnants wanted to do with him, etc remains unresolved because they're going to save it for Season 2. This first season is just about "introduce Baby Yoda and make him do some cute shit to keep casual viewers go 'awww so cute', there's no plot planned, just do whatever the fuck so we can get enough viewers to justify the next season."
Is this episode written by 16 years old?
This episode wanted to be Seven Samurai but ended up as that terrible The Walking Dead episode where everyone gets slaughtered (they're not though in Mandalorian, since this is a Disney series).
There is no development and no build up at all in this episode. Like the previous episode, everything is self-contained. All are introduced and resolved in this same episode. A lot of things happened in this episode but nothing actually contributes to the plot - except for exposition dump.
The bandit raid is a terribly weak, villain of the week setup. They just show up as some evil nuisances - no motives, no goals at all. The Mando teams up with an ex-rebel, which debunks a tired cliche, but at this point this feels like a try-hard attempt to make The Mando as a morally righteous hero. There is a half-assed attempts at romance here, but it feels forced as it happens so sudden. Despite being self-contained (or maybe because it is) the episode lacks closure by the end, and the nifty little scene regarding one stray bounty hunter seems like something that appears just because they still have several episodes to go.
The dialogues are terrible: it's a tonne of exposition dumps. I don't have any idea why the writers think it makes sense for the characters to suddenly ask a stranger, "when was your last time you open your helmet?" and, in return, open up a heart-to-heart "hey I got a tragic story" past to a stranger. The banters with Gina Carano's character is okay, but it feels like they have to slip backstory every now and then. As if they're not having a real, human conversation. Every dialogue feels so forced and hurried as if they have to make it fit into this episode.
Also, it seems like they have no idea what an AT-ST is. It's a vehicle, not a droid.
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@jaw72 how would you know the quality of a product if you only watch it partially? Doh.
This actually is an overall decent finale. The tense in Camina's fleet is good. The Rocinante battle is good. Naomi's rescue is good. The reveal on the end was also good. However there's one reason that makes the episode feels like a jumble of choppily edited scenes: everything involving Alex's death.
I don't take issue with it being sudden and abrupt, as many deaths are. But everyone feels really disconnected from that one incident that should have affected at least all the main casts. Alex just died, but Holden and Naomi spent their time to listen to Naomi's supposed farewell (and spent minutes on it). Amos was more eager to bring Peaches instead of mourning his close friend; even worse he was only informed about Alex's death off screen. For a fellow Martian and somebody who has spent quite a time with Alex, Bobbie seems largely unaffected at all. And Alex, well... The only tribute they gave to this incident is a plaque, which makes for some emotional moment, but that's it. Heck, that part where Holden talked to Naomi to rekindle the events almost feels like Holden breaking the fourth wall to explain to viewers due to how abrupt it is handled.
It almost feels like the event is not supposed to happen, and the showrunners edited in last minutes.
This season has been nothing but a Naomi season that leads to a reunion of Rocinante crew. That incident stuck like a sore thumb, making the supposedly joyful event with all crews gathering feels really emotionally detached. Not to mention that, barring the reveal at the end, most events still happen off screen. Just like most things that happened this season. We don't get to see the impact of something big happening.
So despite being an overall decent episode, this finale closes the relatively most mediocre season The Expanse has produced. I'd even say that the quality is even lower than Season 4. The first four episodes were nice, but it went downhill and stagnated really fast.
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@dtsouza oh for god's sake, save that mediocre exaggerative defense for shows with rabid fans like Mandalorian. Nobody said it has to be done in exaggeration. The death scene only needs to be planned, like Fred's death. Like I said, many deaths were abrupt; what makes the death feels real is how it was edited between the scenes & how others react to it. What we got was obviously a frozen frame of Alex in previous scene with an added CGI blood. It was an unplanned hurried edit that resulted in a bad, chugged in scene.
This is my review so I comment on whatever I wanted. And you're the one who nitpicked that one point regarding Alex's death out of five points I've written. Then the problem is on you.
Review by ragreynolds
VIP7Another good episode, but I must admit that I was kinda disappointed by it as a season finale. It ended well, but the episode felt a bit off. It felt as though every single character just had a sudden change of heart, as though we had missed an entire episode of development. Obviously we knew certain characters were headed a certain way, but they just seemed to suddenly jump from say 60% of the way that they progressed through the last 7 episodes, to 100% just in this one. It felt kinda weird how Homelander just suddenly showed up and got Ryan too - it came out of nowhere. It was still a good episode, but I thought it felt a bit rushed.
Also kinda disappointed that we're kinda just back where we started at the beginning of the season, with no real way to take down Homelander. I was expecting Soldier Boy to take Homelander's powers and then we'd get to see a new side to Homelander next season since he'd be weak and dealing with having no powers. Instead, it seems we're going to get a lot of focus on Ryan and Homelander together - which I do like. I had also thought that maybe all of The Boys would end up with powers by the end of the season, but that didn't happen either (not that that's a bad thing).
Anyway, I thought this was a good episode, but an ever so slightly disappointing end to a fantastic season of TV. Can't wait for season 4.
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@ragreynolds I feel like the cliffhanger-ish, "back to nothing" feeling is kind of pattern. They did this too in Season 1 finale.
Shout by MrBlonde
THE DAMNED
-101-Awesome!
Just fucking Awesome!
The Walking Dead is back on track!So much action in this one...
Oh my. Love it. Can't belive the action goes on.
Morgan going full badass after getting shot. O.o
Savage as fuck!Ezekiel is just... you can't describe it^^
Shiva kills another guy. What's not to like.
Wonder how that hostage situation for Jesus and Tara turns out...
Rick and Daryl at that Outpost. Intense. And as he saw that little baby.
Not all of them are bad. Or are they? Which brings me to the next thing:Morales is back!
Yesss! After all this years!
Creepy to think that if they would have come with him, they could have become Saviors....loading replies
@mrblonde really, who the heck remembers about Morales?
Finally something actually happened after they dragged the season for absolutely nothing.
After four mediocre episodes in a row with three of them being filler, this episode is decent enough. Those previous episodes serve no actual purpose other than waiting for the plot to trigger itself by that call.
The dialogues in this episode could be better and so could the way the scenes are cut, especially for the first half. People seem too eager to join The Mando in his quest for the sake of moving the story. However the last 5-10 the minutes is quite watchable with enough tense. The brute killing in the last scene seems to suggest they're going with the "evil Empire" cliche, but I wish they could do better than that next episode.
It seems like the story just started to be set in motion and we will be left with more questions as Season 1 ends, which unfortunately seems to be Disney+ business model: just make cute Baby Yoda stuff for moms and Star Wars reference for dads, figure things out later in Season 2.
On positive notes, it's nice that they attempt to do more world-building like shocktroopers having signature tattoo, each Imperial province having their own insignia, and the Imperial warlord trying to convince people that the world is better with colonialism.
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@the_argentinian not a hardcore fan, just tired of slowpoke manchildren excusing shitty writing just so they can buy more toys and wish they were Peter Pan. In case you didn't get it: mediocre show unsurprisingly got negative reviews it deserved. Star Wars can be good if they have good writers. Saying "it's Star Wars" is just nonsense to excuse manufacturing adult's barbie.
That Baby Yoda is too damn cute!! OMG I laughed so hard when he pressed the button after being told not to touch anything.
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@lunatee the fact that in a Seven Samurai-wannabe episode, only the Baby Yoda "cuteness" stands out, clearly shows that this is a terrible Disney kid show.
6.4/10. I enjoyed the season premiere of The Walking Dead better than most. I understand the complaints that it was too bleak, too cruel, and too hopeless, but to my mind, it made sense to establish Negan as a threat and as a character. There have been so many ineffectual bad guys on this show, so many antagonists who seemed like mere speed bumps along the way toward Rick & Co. getting the big win. It makes sense to me that TWD needed to make a big introduction to convince the audience that Negan and The Saviors were something different and something serious.
I also didn’t mind the hopelessness of it. Sure, it’s difficult to see the good guys broken, to see characters we know and love brutalized, to see the bad guys seem to take great joy in the process. But shows like The Walking Dead need stakes. In order for the heroes’ inevitable triumph to feel earned and meaningful, you need to make the villain not only someone whose loss doesn’t seem preordained, but who’s worth beating. The suffering at this point of the arc will, with any luck, pay off down the line when the good guys strike their blow against Negan and his goons.
The problem is that the premiere, “The Day Will Come When You Won’t Be,” already felt like a lot. It was a lot of blood and guts, a lot of horrible acts, and a lot of Negan preening and chewing scenery. It works as an opening salvo for the character and as the culmination of the build to Negan that had been bubbling up since the midpoint of Season 6, but it’s a lot to take in. The audience can only stand so much of that level of cruelty and velvet-lined venom before it starts to overwhelm.
Which means that an episode that basically acted as a sequel to the premiere, that gave us buckets and buckets of Negan’s routine, that skimped on the violence but doubled down on the lack of hope idea, comes off as rubbing the viewer’s noses in all of this. Making “Service” a super-sized episode to boot, one that packs in an extra twenty minutes or so worth of the same sneering bad guy stuff, the same hammered home message about Alexandria’s weak position, worsens the problem.
It’s especially rough for the character of Negan himself. I’ve enjoyed Jeffrey Dean Morgan’s performance as the season’s new big bad. It’s a difficult character to find the balance of. By definition, he has to be outsized, someone so grandiose and convinced of his own smoothness, but also someone who feels like a predator and not just a clown. Morgan pulls that off. He has Negan’s shit-eating grin down pat. He lays into his lines with a joy and a casual cruelty that lets you know he thinks of himself as the cock of the walk and the coolest guy in the room.
But again, too much of that begins to wear. The Walking Dead has had outsized characters before -- The Governor probably comes closest to Negan’s theatrical bent -- but so far Negan has really only played that one note. He gives you the sort of gleeful menace, the man who toys with his prey and thinks himself a just and noble ruler. That works well enough in small doses, but pile it on like TWD does in “Service” and you start to see the seams. It begins to feel as though the show is spinning its wheels, repeating itself as Negan simply reestablishes the things previously established memorably in previous episodes.
It also doesn’t help that “Service” has absolutely plodding pacing. Not every Walking Dead episode needs to be eventful of full of fast-paced action, but despite some effort at conflict on the margins, most of this episode is just a big walk around Alexandria for The Saviors. Seeing the effect that Negan has on the rest of the camp, the way the last bits of resistance are meant to be stamped out, is a valid and arguably necessary tack to take in the aftermath of the events of the season premiere, but there’s not enough there, or at least not enough of what we’ve seen, to fill an episode all on its own, let alone one with an extended runtime.
Those conflicts feel fairly tepid. The missing guns provides fodder for Rick to give one of his trademark speeches, albeit one about knuckling under rather than fighting back. This episode is full of reminders, constant conversations, and loud declarations, that “this is our lives now,” that things are different and can’t go back to the way they were. So when Rick finds Spencer’s guns and turns them over to Negan in exchange for Olivia’s life, it’s anticlimactic, feeling like there was never really much of a risk, but that the whole issue was drummed up, forced conflict to give a reason for that speech and to accentuate the mostly forgotten wedge between Rick and Spencer.
“Service” plants the seeds for that growing rift, with Spencer still resentful of Rick after the death of his parents, and laying the Saviors’ new order at his feet. It’s an issue that’s bound to come up at an inconvenient time, quite possibly with Spencer trying to make his own deal with Negan and ending up meeting a grisly end for the trouble after Negan decides to stick with Rick for his greater earning potential. But in the brief time we’ve known him, Spencer’s never been a particularly interesting character, which makes it hard to be too invested in that storyline or its implications.
The same can largely be said for Rosita, though she’s gotten a bit more characterization and adventure over the past couple of seasons. She is part of a different strain running through this episode, of people who are poised and ready to resist The Saviors, even if they don’t quite have the tools or the plan to do so just yet. Her task to retrieve Daryl’s bike (and attempt to find a gun from one of Dwight’s deceased running buddies) mostly serves as yet another opportunity for people to debate whether The Saviors can be stopped or whether the denizens of Alexandria should simply accept that this is how things are now. We’re given plenty of plausible justifications -- that The Saviors have greater numbers, more weapons, and a ruthlessness that makes them a threat to everyone and everything -- but the endless back and forth over it (probably meant to answer the “why don’t they just mount a resistance now?” question from the audience) isn’t particularly compelling.
It also bleeds into an uncomfortable air of rape among The Saviors. We see it in the disgusting way that Negan talks about Maggie (who, in one of the cannier narrative choices, has been whisked away elsewhere before Rick tells Negan she passed away). We see it in Dwight’s uncomfortable treatment of Rosita, and we see it in the particularly unsettling way that one of Negan’s henchmen tries to get Enid to repeat the word please.
I’m of two minds about this. On the one hand, as uncomfortable as these moments are, we’re talking about the bad guys here. We’re not supposed to like them, and so deplorable behavior is more excusable. What’s more, rape is about power, and the overtones to Negan’s behavior underscores the way in which he is, despite his violent and sexual appetites, clearly interested in the power of his acts, the way it allows him to act unfettered and unchallenged, than any inherent pleasure he gets from them. On the other hand, in the henchmen especially, it feels like a cheap way to make them seem more villainous, a shorthand in lieu of something better earned or more thematic. It all depends on where the show takes this particular thread in the rest of the season.
The same goes for the episode’s closing scenes. Michonne is exactly the type who, as her experience with The Governor portends, will not sit idly by while someone like this prances around and tries to keep her people under his thumb. But Rick’s speech, while not enough to convince her, at least ties the “we have to do what Negan says” sledgehammer of a point into something emotional and steeped in the history of the series.
The parallels are loose, but when Rick confesses that he knows Judith belongs to Shane, there’s power in it because it’s one of those few plot threads from the beginning of the show that haven’t been tied off yet. And the thematic resonance of it, that sometimes we have to accept hard truths, things that tear us up, in order to do what we need to do to protect the people we care about, is solid. Negan’s actions make Rick’s knuckles tighten up on Lucille when Negan’s back is turned, but his desire to keep the Alexandrians safe loosens his grip, allows him to make all these compromises and admission in the hopes that they’ll stay alive and healthy even under such harsh conditions.
That’s a fine way to dramatize the yoke under which Rick and Michonne and their band of survivors are living, the choices they must make every day. It’s just too much of Negan’s scenery-chewing, self-aggrandizing flotsam to where that resolution feels like too little too late.
It’s important to establish your villains. It’s important to make them notable characters in their own right, and to show them besting the heroes, posing a genuine threat, so that the eventual victory doesn’t feel hollow. But when you spend so much time with this bastard, so much time reinforcing how terrible he is and how little hope there is, those remaining moments when you try to show that there may be a light at the end of the tunnel, a reason behind the capitulation, it feels like a mere tiny bit of salve after forty minutes with your hand in the fire. Strong villains are good, but make them monolithic and give entire, overly long episodes over to their villainy, and the audience will be as apt to give up as Rick is.
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@andrewbloom well done, a very thoughtful review. You aptly describe what's also in my mind. Not sure what else to comment for this eps haha.
Review by ragreynolds
VIP7Another good episode, but I must admit that I was kinda disappointed by it as a season finale. It ended well, but the episode felt a bit off. It felt as though every single character just had a sudden change of heart, as though we had missed an entire episode of development. Obviously we knew certain characters were headed a certain way, but they just seemed to suddenly jump from say 60% of the way that they progressed through the last 7 episodes, to 100% just in this one. It felt kinda weird how Homelander just suddenly showed up and got Ryan too - it came out of nowhere. It was still a good episode, but I thought it felt a bit rushed.
Also kinda disappointed that we're kinda just back where we started at the beginning of the season, with no real way to take down Homelander. I was expecting Soldier Boy to take Homelander's powers and then we'd get to see a new side to Homelander next season since he'd be weak and dealing with having no powers. Instead, it seems we're going to get a lot of focus on Ryan and Homelander together - which I do like. I had also thought that maybe all of The Boys would end up with powers by the end of the season, but that didn't happen either (not that that's a bad thing).
Anyway, I thought this was a good episode, but an ever so slightly disappointing end to a fantastic season of TV. Can't wait for season 4.
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@ragreynolds you summed up my feelings in a much concise way, thanks!
Finally something actually happened after they dragged the season for absolutely nothing.
After four mediocre episodes in a row with three of them being filler, this episode is decent enough. Those previous episodes serve no actual purpose other than waiting for the plot to trigger itself by that call.
The dialogues in this episode could be better and so could the way the scenes are cut, especially for the first half. People seem too eager to join The Mando in his quest for the sake of moving the story. However the last 5-10 the minutes is quite watchable with enough tense. The brute killing in the last scene seems to suggest they're going with the "evil Empire" cliche, but I wish they could do better than that next episode.
It seems like the story just started to be set in motion and we will be left with more questions as Season 1 ends, which unfortunately seems to be Disney+ business model: just make cute Baby Yoda stuff for moms and Star Wars reference for dads, figure things out later in Season 2.
On positive notes, it's nice that they attempt to do more world-building like shocktroopers having signature tattoo, each Imperial province having their own insignia, and the Imperial warlord trying to convince people that the world is better with colonialism.
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@the_argentinian said the brain-dead Disney consumer who never read/watch quality Star Wars material like Knights of the Old Republic or Thrawn trilogy and gulp shit content as breakfast.
Shout by Carlos Teran
The good about this episode: The New Republic is very serious about law and order, we get to see Twi'leks again, a very unrecognizable Clancy Brown and the cameos of David Filoni and the directors of all the previous episodes as X-Wing pilots. Also, we now get an idea how hyperspace navigation in the Star Wars universe is all bout. The ending with the 3 baddies on the cell alive made this episode very kid friendly, and I don't mind that. The bad about this episode: Zero planning for the prison break, and it shows. The Twi'lek make-up looks very cheap and the acting of both of actors is uneven. The X-Wings arrive more than 20 minutes after the beacon is activated. So, no troops?. Nobody is driving the prison ship anymore, so I guess that it's a death sentence for everyone aboard that ship when they run out of air, water and food, unless somebody gets to them.
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@guenguer no, I understood you. The movies are not Star Wars, yes. But neither is the show.
The first two episodes, well, yeah, maybe, I guess. But from the 3rd episode onward The Mandalorian has always been a Disney series, not a Star Wars series. Lazy screenwriting, characters make dumb decisions, no nuanced morality - just a morally good hero against bad people. It's only Star Wars on surface level - just because they keep on dropping references and have a good knowledge on the universe. But it's not a show with a meat. It's all style, no substance.
Compare this to Knights of the Old Republic (the single player game), Thrawn trilogy (novel), or even Bounty Hunter (game) which also features the bounty hunter Jango Fett. Those are how you do Star Wars.
Shout by Carlos Teran
The good about this episode: The New Republic is very serious about law and order, we get to see Twi'leks again, a very unrecognizable Clancy Brown and the cameos of David Filoni and the directors of all the previous episodes as X-Wing pilots. Also, we now get an idea how hyperspace navigation in the Star Wars universe is all bout. The ending with the 3 baddies on the cell alive made this episode very kid friendly, and I don't mind that. The bad about this episode: Zero planning for the prison break, and it shows. The Twi'lek make-up looks very cheap and the acting of both of actors is uneven. The X-Wings arrive more than 20 minutes after the beacon is activated. So, no troops?. Nobody is driving the prison ship anymore, so I guess that it's a death sentence for everyone aboard that ship when they run out of air, water and food, unless somebody gets to them.
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@guenguer if you think this series is not on the same level of quality with the Disney trilogy, it appears we're watching a different show.
Others might say that this is not as intense as previous episode, which might be true in terms of action and moving the plot forward. But I find this episode is still intense in a different way: more emotional investment.
"Family" and its unfortunately related cousin "abuse" seem to be the the theme that knits together different story arcs of the episode: the obvious Butcher flashback, Kimiko and Frenchie, MM with his family, Soldier Boy, and Homelander.
The episode kind of speeds up the pace in showing Soldier Boy's villainy through a recreation/imagination of Black Noir's flashback; although I'm not too comfortable that they present Noir's flashback at face value (instead of being an unreliable narrator), I think it still kinda works.
It is shown that Soldier Boy is an abusive, selfish bully with anger issues you would typically see among band leads or celebrity groups. While some have defended Soldier Boy's action by comparing him to Homelander ("at least Soldier Boy is not psychotic, emotionally unstable narcissist! He is a normal person not grown in lab!"), I think they missed the point of the show: the biggest issue here is exactly what would happen if people with power (influence) have additional power (literal superpower) while being protected by multi-billion dollar company. They possess all the impunity to wreak havoc. Like MM said, "no one should have the right to wield such power."
This theme of abuse is explicated with Butcher's flashback. No one is inherently "good" or "evil" - you are shaped by your upbringing. As the scenes between his memories, his reflection, and his projection in current time are cut seamlessly back and forth, Butcher slowly realizes that he mirrors the man he hated the most. Yet he fully accepts his succumbing to that darkness while bringing Hughie with him through his personal vendetta against the supes - not caring about the risk towards others who he claimed he loved. Even with parents, one may grow to be a contemptuous person if they live in an abusive family, and it's a cycle that is very difficult to break. Butcher's flashback is certainly the spotlight of the episode for me.
Even with Kimiko's story in the background (her saying that V only explicates what kind of person you are), considering that we've been shown how the character's social lives shaped them into what they are now - Kimiko with her abducted kid background, Hughie's insecurity with his zero to hero job, etc - the message stays strong, countering the superhero cliche of inherently morally good and evil person.
I'm hoping this dynamic could be further explored in the next episode (or season) with the Soldier Boy and Homelander encounter when it's revealed that Soldier Boy is Homelander's father, at least he feels so. An abusive father meets a narcissist kid-who'd-wanna-be-a-father. The ending of this episode becomes revealing when tied up to the earlier convesation between Homelander and Maeve: with Homelander echoing Soldier Boy's words that he "used to dream of having kids" with Maeve, it becomes apparent in this episode that the relationship between Homelander and Maeve (and Soldier Boy and Crimson Countess) it is not something exactly out of pure love.
"Having kids" is not a romantic statement: it's a purely masculine, self-centered ego of having someone of your blood - of your similarity - that you can be proud of. Who the partner is doesn't matter; they are only means to that end. And in that Soldier Boy shares something in common with Homelander as shown through his delight of accepting Homelander readily as his son, albeit lab-grown. He only wants to see a better version of him.
Last but not least, I love the jab at corporate this episode still throws. Ashley spinning breaking news about Starlight in a similar way Disney would spin stories about their abuse and mismanagement; and that A-Train being zombified, again, with the heart of Blue Hawk embedded in his body, serving only as Vought's puppet. I'm not sure if that's the most satisfying end to A-Train's arc, but seeing his disappointed, grim look, his lack of agency, I guess the character suffers a lot. I just hope this will be the last of his arc and the show doesn't squeeze him further.
That said, with the reveal at the ending, I am not sure I am 100% satisfied as I was expecting Soldier Boy bringing down Homelander, or rendering him powerless by the end of the season. Looks like Homelander will continue to be the main villain. I just hope they don't prolong the "mentally unstable" trope too much and find ways to keep the show interesting. Looking forward to the finale.
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@tesbreag do you know what an unreliable narrator means? An unreliable narrator's credibility has to be compromised in the writing. This episode doesn't show that. If anything: it intends to complete and confirm Mallory's recollection of the events, beginning with the exact same, word-to-word conversation (between Edgar and Black Noir) and details like Countess showing up the last with less bruises and damages than others. It doesn't contradict what the audience knows of the story so far. The narrator himself (Black Noir) is not contradicting himself in his recollection - no gaps in the memory, no uncertainty. If anything the cartoon session begins with the one of them saying that the memory is "buried within" Black Noir, implying certainty.
Didn't Clarissa's implant stuff use to look better? :thinking:
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@ansik yeah the S3 mod fight looked more feral. Seems odd that Amazon didn't have a budget to choreograph a fight.
Shout by Just Another Movie Nerd
VIP10This season has turned into a bloody soap opera. Really disappointing actually.
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@pjonsson well if you're expecting a Die Hard you're watching a wrong show... the show has always been rather slow-paced, though this season does lack one focus.
The beginning of the episode left me wishing we could've seen more of this side of Star Wars: regular stormtroopers doing their job, getting into action, and all the unseen dynamics rarely mentioned in the mainstream film trilogies. We did have something in that vein: Republic Commando explored the lives of elite Republic clone troopers; Jedi Academy had us follow the lives of youngling under tutelage of Luke's academy; the original Battlefront showed us the transitioning of a republic to an empire through the eyes of the soldiers.
It's the lives of the mundane, the less than extraordinary, yet still gripping and intriguing. They let us dive deeper to the world of Star Wars beyond the flashy buzzing of lightsabers and spectacles of the magical force.
The Mandalorian wished it could be one of those. Unfortunately, it failed terribly.
In episode 5, @ShrimpBoatSteve has said that the series has became too predictable, and I agree - the finale shows how predictable the whole season is. https://trakt.tv/comments/264475
After the long flashback which most parts we've already seen in previous episodes - seemingly making the scenes feels almost like a filler - The Mandalorian episode 8 seems reluctant to set their foot to the ground with its notable world-building as previously seen in Eps 7 and Eps 1 to 3. As I have previously said, after everyone gangs on The Mando (Eps 7), Baby Yoda/Little One's background (who Baby Yoda is, why is he wanted, what the Imperial remnants wanted to do with him, etc) remains unresolved. As the episode shows us Moff Gideon rising with a darksaber in hand, yet another reference moment: every substance the show can possibly offer will be dealt only in Season 2 (or, worse, more).
Stormtroopers in Star Wars have been infamous for their terribly inaccurate shots, but in this episode it feels like their incompetency is amplified to the point of parody and, of course, plot armors. Scout troopers - which is supposed to be snipers - can't shoot droid right in front of their eyes. Instead of coming in squads, troopers only come individually (incinerators burning the building, a few troopers slaughtered by the blacksmith, a few others guarding the tunnel, and the most stupid of all, Moff Gideon waiting for nightfall just for no reason) which makes for a convenient plot armors for our heroes to trek on their way.
Of course, there are casualties - what is a story without something seemingly at a stake? - but it is nothing more than devices to delay the heroes from their trek. Taking cues from Eowyn's "I am no man" of Lord of the Rings fame, in less than moment-defining fashion IG-11, which himself came as a sort of droid ex machina, said that it is no "living being" while resurrecting The Mando from fatal injuries, remedied every possible threat with its healing devices.
Antagonists can be dumb, but there is a limit to dumbness that can suspend audience's disbelief. This episode has antagonist almost feels like they are intentionally dumb and there is nothing really at a stake when everything can be easily remedied.
This episode is not the worst, certainly, as the action sequence is flashy and satisfying. The one near ending where The Mando utilizes a neat jet jump is clever and actually can show the extent Star Wars can be when the director wanted to think creatively beyond the force. Knights of the Old Republic and the aptly named Star Wars Bounty Hunter played with clever tricks similar to this once a while, and the trick doesn't feel cheap as they stand on a very good storytelling.
The Mandalorian's flashy action, regardless, seems to serve only as explicit fanservice - a style over substance.
There are plenty of action, which, by itself, is quite well-done. The consistently hardly imposing threats, unfortunately, dull down the possible thrill those scenes can offer - in a typical corny action heroes such as Gerard Butler's character in Has Fallen trilogy. The scene, for example, with The Blacksmith let us peek into the martial arts capability a Mandalorian can exhibit. But the rather plot armor of incompetent stormtroopers leave no stake at hand; the martial arts dexterity looks more like a cheap imitation of main trilogies of Jedi's acrobatic feats.
Redemption ultimately ends with nothing to be redeemed about, as the people in this show seems to be forever clumsy. From start to finish, everyone made questionable decisions. Nobody blasted the Mando's group with that large amount of stormtroopers. Nobody checked whether Moff Gideon is dead when the fighter was down (Gideon also miraculously survive the crash), with Carga, a supposedly veteran bounty hunter, lightheartedly saying they are already free of the Empire's grasp.
Everything people said in this episode, just like many episodes prior, are not crafted as if the actors were having human conversation. They were rushed by time - they seemingly appear to be set in motion by the plot's demands, to say X so Y happens; to say A when B moment happened.
This episode almost feels like a filler to conclude the dragging episodes this season has been. Screenwriting-wise, this whole season is nothing but bait-and-switch to justify next season(s).
There is much to be said about this kind of terrible business model, where series is written with nothing exactly in mind but to find reasons to continue producing the franchise - the same business model Disney has been using on their MCU franchise and Star Wars films/spinoffs - but the crowds of gladly willing moms awing for Baby Yoda and nerd dads geeking over Star Wars reference doesn't leave enough rooms for those commentaries.
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@alexleedee no one is forced to read my reviews. If anyone feels startled by my thoughts on it just read those other abundant feel-good reviews.
The beginning of the episode left me wishing we could've seen more of this side of Star Wars: regular stormtroopers doing their job, getting into action, and all the unseen dynamics rarely mentioned in the mainstream film trilogies. We did have something in that vein: Republic Commando explored the lives of elite Republic clone troopers; Jedi Academy had us follow the lives of youngling under tutelage of Luke's academy; the original Battlefront showed us the transitioning of a republic to an empire through the eyes of the soldiers.
It's the lives of the mundane, the less than extraordinary, yet still gripping and intriguing. They let us dive deeper to the world of Star Wars beyond the flashy buzzing of lightsabers and spectacles of the magical force.
The Mandalorian wished it could be one of those. Unfortunately, it failed terribly.
In episode 5, @ShrimpBoatSteve has said that the series has became too predictable, and I agree - the finale shows how predictable the whole season is. https://trakt.tv/comments/264475
After the long flashback which most parts we've already seen in previous episodes - seemingly making the scenes feels almost like a filler - The Mandalorian episode 8 seems reluctant to set their foot to the ground with its notable world-building as previously seen in Eps 7 and Eps 1 to 3. As I have previously said, after everyone gangs on The Mando (Eps 7), Baby Yoda/Little One's background (who Baby Yoda is, why is he wanted, what the Imperial remnants wanted to do with him, etc) remains unresolved. As the episode shows us Moff Gideon rising with a darksaber in hand, yet another reference moment: every substance the show can possibly offer will be dealt only in Season 2 (or, worse, more).
Stormtroopers in Star Wars have been infamous for their terribly inaccurate shots, but in this episode it feels like their incompetency is amplified to the point of parody and, of course, plot armors. Scout troopers - which is supposed to be snipers - can't shoot droid right in front of their eyes. Instead of coming in squads, troopers only come individually (incinerators burning the building, a few troopers slaughtered by the blacksmith, a few others guarding the tunnel, and the most stupid of all, Moff Gideon waiting for nightfall just for no reason) which makes for a convenient plot armors for our heroes to trek on their way.
Of course, there are casualties - what is a story without something seemingly at a stake? - but it is nothing more than devices to delay the heroes from their trek. Taking cues from Eowyn's "I am no man" of Lord of the Rings fame, in less than moment-defining fashion IG-11, which himself came as a sort of droid ex machina, said that it is no "living being" while resurrecting The Mando from fatal injuries, remedied every possible threat with its healing devices.
Antagonists can be dumb, but there is a limit to dumbness that can suspend audience's disbelief. This episode has antagonist almost feels like they are intentionally dumb and there is nothing really at a stake when everything can be easily remedied.
This episode is not the worst, certainly, as the action sequence is flashy and satisfying. The one near ending where The Mando utilizes a neat jet jump is clever and actually can show the extent Star Wars can be when the director wanted to think creatively beyond the force. Knights of the Old Republic and the aptly named Star Wars Bounty Hunter played with clever tricks similar to this once a while, and the trick doesn't feel cheap as they stand on a very good storytelling.
The Mandalorian's flashy action, regardless, seems to serve only as explicit fanservice - a style over substance.
There are plenty of action, which, by itself, is quite well-done. The consistently hardly imposing threats, unfortunately, dull down the possible thrill those scenes can offer - in a typical corny action heroes such as Gerard Butler's character in Has Fallen trilogy. The scene, for example, with The Blacksmith let us peek into the martial arts capability a Mandalorian can exhibit. But the rather plot armor of incompetent stormtroopers leave no stake at hand; the martial arts dexterity looks more like a cheap imitation of main trilogies of Jedi's acrobatic feats.
Redemption ultimately ends with nothing to be redeemed about, as the people in this show seems to be forever clumsy. From start to finish, everyone made questionable decisions. Nobody blasted the Mando's group with that large amount of stormtroopers. Nobody checked whether Moff Gideon is dead when the fighter was down (Gideon also miraculously survive the crash), with Carga, a supposedly veteran bounty hunter, lightheartedly saying they are already free of the Empire's grasp.
Everything people said in this episode, just like many episodes prior, are not crafted as if the actors were having human conversation. They were rushed by time - they seemingly appear to be set in motion by the plot's demands, to say X so Y happens; to say A when B moment happened.
This episode almost feels like a filler to conclude the dragging episodes this season has been. Screenwriting-wise, this whole season is nothing but bait-and-switch to justify next season(s).
There is much to be said about this kind of terrible business model, where series is written with nothing exactly in mind but to find reasons to continue producing the franchise - the same business model Disney has been using on their MCU franchise and Star Wars films/spinoffs - but the crowds of gladly willing moms awing for Baby Yoda and nerd dads geeking over Star Wars reference doesn't leave enough rooms for those commentaries.
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@badcontestant I am, and you're not invited. Get out.
I am just more and more underwhelmed by what we're seeing with this series. It's not bad, but it's certainly not very meaty either. What, exactly, are the themes? The overarching struggle that I'm supposed to attach my empathy to? Baby Yoda is incredibly cute, but one off episodes of The Mandalorian thwarting unconnected threats feels like it's just going to get more and more stale. These episodes have been entertaining (this one least of all), but I want something to chew on.
I have to laugh though. The Star Wars fanbase is incredibly fickle and hypocritical. The idea that we hear so much hate for the sequel trilogy and then this series is being lauded by those same fans is hilarious. What are some of the major complaints they have for the sequels? Rey is a Mary-Sue and Star Wars is being Disney-fied?
Have they actually watched this show then? Or are they just enamored by the cuteness of Baby Yoda? The Mandalorian is arguably a bigger Mary-Sue than Rey (who honestly isn't a Mary-Sue, but if she is then so was Luke Skywalker in the originals lol). And this series is far more Disney-fied than either The Force Awakens or The Last Jedi.
:person_shrugging::male_sign:
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@hcolesmith95 Exactly. This show is only saved by Baby Yoda's cuteness. But it's all style over substance. This show is Disney right to the core.
[9.1/10] “A war of all against all.” That is how political philosopher Thomas Hobbes described the “state of nature” of man without government, without rule. He imagined a life that was “nasty, brutish, and short” and posited that people needed a Leviathan, the force of the government, to enforce laws, and have people give up certain freedoms as the price for avoiding such an unenviable way to live.
In Negan’s mind, he is that Leviathan. The last time The Walking Dead interrogated Negan’s moral philosophy, it left it somewhat ambiguous how Negan saw himself, whether he really believed that his brutal ways were for the greater good, or whether he was just spinning propaganda to justify the comparatively lavish and carefree lifestyle he gets to enjoy while others toil.
“The Big Scary U” is much less ambiguous. There is a certain sense that Negan may be deluding himself, offering rationalizations and eliding the darker or more self-serving side of the choices he’s made, but it becomes clear that he is a true believer, someone who thinks that he’s doing what needs to be done.
The episode explores that with one of the oldest tropes in the book -- two characters, trapped in a room together, deciding to find common ground and reflect on their lives, shared enmity, and personal truths. (Think “Fly” from fellow AMC stablemate Breaking Bad.) “The Big Scary U” catches up with Negan and Father Gabriel, trapped in a temporary building and surrounded by walkers after the events of the premiere.
In those close, perilous quarters, Gabriel asks for Negan’s confession. A brief flashback signifies (in TWD’s typically lofty tones) that Gabriel no longer fears death; he just fears a meaningless death. And in the present, he reasons that maybe the reason he’s survived this long, the purpose he’s been in search of, is hear Negan confess and give him absolution.
But Negan declares he has nothing to attone for. He uses the confinement to lay out his philosophy -- that however bad things may seem under his watch, that it’s better than the alternative, and that what came before, and what would come after him, would be much much worse.
“The Big Scary U” seems to suggest that Negan’s right, at least within his own fiefdom. When the episode isn’t centered on Negan and Gabriel’s heart-to-heart, it’s in the heart of The Sanctuary, where all of Negan’s lieutenants are scrambling to figure out what to do in the absence and possible demise of their leader, and backbiting, disagreement, and recriminations come to a head.
Regina wants to sacrifice the workers to make an escape. Eugene declares that it will never work. Gavin declares that somebody must be collaborating with Rick & Co. given how things went down. Dwight deflects and is ready to read the riot act to whomever needs to hear it. And Simon, who seems to be the closest thing to a second-in-command ready to take over, tries to hold court.
It’s fascinating watching the various forces that Negan has amassed slowly turn on one another, ally with one another, and generally seem lost without him there to guide them. Negan has inculcated a need for a dictator, for an unquestioned leader who can whip people into shape. As soon as the man and his baseball bat are gone, things start deteriorating, with workers staging the beginnings of a revolt, the remaining leaders not knowing what to do, and the situation getting volatile quickly.
But The Walking Dead plays at least a little coy about whether this really is the better alternative, or whether this is simply the world Negan created. It’s easy for Negan to pontificate and preen with Gabriel about how things would fall apart without him, that his presence is necessary to bring order and security, but what if that’s just true for the little ecosystem that Negan has overseen? What if he’s built things to be that way, rather than that things have to be that way.
Rick certainly seems to think there’s another way, even if Daryl remains skeptical and more Negan-like himself by the minute. “The Big Scary U” comes down to, as so many TWD episodes do, to the question of whether it’s okay to kill someone, “the right person,” in order to achieve some sort of greater good. And it positions all its major characters on different sides of the question.
Daryl has turned single-minded and unbothered by the potential loss of life in taking out The Saviors, even if it means that the innocent workers at The Sanctuary perish in the process. Rick pushes back against him, wanting to stick to the plan, even if the fighters from The Kingdom are killed, because he doesn’t want to take innocent lives. Negan believes in killing people, even innocent people, if it serves a greater cause, while Gabriel believes in saving people, even bad people like Gregory, if it serves a higher power. And Gregory himself has no scruples, no principles, one way or another, only caring to keep himself alive whatever that may require.
Negan and Gabriel also have to keep themselves alive, as the walkers slowly but surely start to break through the meager walls and barriers separating them and the two morsels inside. That’s mainly a plot device to ensure that Negan and Gabriel can’t just keep talking forever (thank heaven) but it at least creates some urgency and sense of place in the midst of what is basically a miniature stage show starring these two men.
It’s a real showcase for Jeffrey Dean Morgan in particular. Let’s face it; Negan is a pretty ridiculous character. Some of that is intentional, with the persona being meant to project a certain amount of intimidating bombast. But some of it is just an inherent part of putting such an outsized figure into a nominally down-to-earth take on the zombie genre. Nevertheless, Morgan has the chops to go big and go small as the situation requires, and make it convincing in either guise.
That’s why his pronouncements about “saving” people, his pretzel logic about the difference between “killing the right people” and “letting your people get killed” (blame-shifting logic which Daryl starts to share), don’t sound as insane as they might here. There is a conviction in Morgan’s voice when he delivers those lines, a certainty in the truth of them that informs the character’s perspective and makes it feel true to who Negan is, even if the audience isn’t supposed to take it as true generally.
But we also winces just enough when confronted about his “wives” and grimaces through his excuse that they “made a choice.” His deflection about the state of his “workers” functions as an internalized dismissal of any economy having “winners and loser.” And he even breaks down, such as a proud guy like Negan can, and admits the only time he was “weak” was when he could not put his “real wife” down after she turned. Like much of the show, it’s a little too neat as informative backstory, but the actor makes it work.
It works because Negan believes it. He believes that killing people to create order, that harshness can make people and civilizations stronger, that engendering submission, even in lethal terms, can save lives. There’s a twisted worldview at the heart of Negan’s philosophies on governance and leadership, ones with antecedents across history, but for all the metaphysical and ethical conversations at play here, it’s the truth of this view in his eyes, the palpable sense of belief from Negan as he champions the need for that Leviathan, that makes the villain more than a bunch of cruel deaths and priapic boasts. He represents the worse angels of our nature, the ones that say we need to be cowed less we tear one another apart, and the hints that he may be right, at least for the part of this world he’s overseen, makes him all the more terrifying.
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@andrewbloom Great review. Having lived in a post-authoritarian country myself, I can see how Negan's logic fits neatly with logics of many real-life dictators - and the people they ruled. The scene where the workers stopped protesting the moment Negan return seems to show the belief that one great man can solve everything.
boring boring boring... Where is Michone, Rosita, Carl? and for how many more episodes are they gonna keep Negan alive?
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@_poison_xo TWD has a lot of flaws, but sure this is not the reason. It's an okay episode, giving some characters to Negan beyond his ill-mannered jokes.
I was expecting mutant or superheroes. I've heard of Xmen legacy. How disappointing.
Only a mad man delusional in an asylum, more than an hourlong. Atmosphere is disturbing. More horror show than sci-fi.
Episode 1 is very long and very boring. Dancing scenes was so ridiculous.
If you like Marvel caractères run away.loading replies
@fo2x That's intentional, it's what Noah Hawley (the director) wants to avoid: people who only watch this as "le superheroes in TV seriezzz" instead of focusing on the characters or story. Things like Agents of Shield may fit you better.
Review by Andrew Bloom
VIP9One of the best parts of Carol's storylines on The Walking Dead is that they've largely been underplayed. Melissa McBride is such a talented actress that the show can dispense with its often lumpy dialogue and simply let her convey the meaning in the moment, whether it's a sullen look after the events of "JSS" or the harsh tone in her voice when she tells Rick that Maggie shouldn't be out on the raid. This season in particular, The Walking Dead had done a good job at letting the idea of Carol feeling the weight of her actions and gradually pivoting away from the ruthless persona of strength she'd taken on bubble under the surface, thereby making the scenes where those themes are a little more prominent stand out as earned and effective.
But "The Same Boat" basically turns that subtlety on its ear. It's a bleak bottle episode, that spends most of its time keeping Carol in a single room and trotting out an odd version of "This Is Your Life!" There's Maggie as a symbol of uncorrupted innocence and incipient motherhood there to let Carol fight to protect something in another person that she herself has lost. There's the colorful Molly, who offers Carol a view of her possible future, a dead woman walking who's not afraid to do what need doing. There's Donnie, a nearly textbook abusive boyfriend who's mostly a prop to draw out another parallel for Carol. That parallel is Paula, who is both a dark reflection of what Carol has become--a woman who lost her children, dealt with abuse, and resolved to kill when necessary without compunction or hesitation--and a living caution of what Carol is afraid that Maggie could become.
These are all interesting character comparisons in particular, but given that all of these people have to be introduced and die in the same episode, the audience necessarily gets thumbnail sketches of everyone rather than meaningful shades of character development to make them feel like real people rather than narrative devices to elucidate Carol's internal conflict. The episode does a good job in giving Carol's captors texture--Molly in particular is someone I'm sad to see go given how distinct and magnetic she was with little weight to carry here--but their characterization is thin, and that inevitably leads to the feeling that "The Same Boat" is more of a contrived allegory than a story with emotional truth.
That's especially true for Paula, a well-acted, poorly-written character who seems to have little use besides acting as the obvious living wakeup call for Carol she's meant to reflect and turning subtext into brutally on-the-nose text. When she blasts Carol for being weak, when she spits Carol's philosophy back at her in a clumsy fashion, when vocalizes that Carol sees Maggie as the way she used to be, it's all unnecessary emotional exposition about themes the show had already communicated in much subtler ways. I actually liked the idea of Paula as an antagonist because the performance is good, and there's a harsh pragmatism to her that makes her an interesting comparison point to Rick as much as she is to Carol. But when she launches into that monologue it becomes clear that she's only here to be a ponderous, poorly-sketched out doppleganger for Carol, with nothing under her skin but cheesy dialogue and didactic speeches.
Melissa McBride does what she can to save all of this. Her performance does a very nice job of showing Carol's simultaneous cunning and her pain. She's obfuscating timidness to disarm her captors, the same way she used that persona to keep the Alexandrians off guard. But McBride does a great job of selling the moments where Carol's real concerns, her genuine conflicted feelings about the choices she's made, bleed through. More than that, the episode shows her using those real feelings to further the lie, a tactic composed of equal parts canniness and pathos.
There's a bit of Morgan's philosophy that's wormed its way into Carol's thinking, whether she likes or it hates the way it makes her shoot an intruder in the arm rather than in the chest, or hesitate when a single bullet could practically end the whole struggle. Carol become this hardened warrior so that she could protect the innocent, so that what happened with Sofia wouldn't happen again. It's why what rouses her from her mild pacifist streak is Paula's swipe at Maggie's stomach. But as bluntly as the concept is hammered home in "The Same Boat", Carol has been wounded in that process, and when she looks at the deaths she's been responsible for, at the harshness she's perpetrated in the same of doing what's necessary, she doesn't necessarily like the person she sees, and begins to not only question that path, but to slowly feel more and more of the hurt of it all.
I'm hardly a Carol-Daryl shipper, but there's has always been a special friendship on the show, and one of the most pleasant moments in a dark episode was his immediately comforting her after she and Maggie kill the last couple of Saviors. Maybe he can help her find a bit of peace.
But that brutality doesn't stop at Carol. "The Same Boat" also suggests that it's infected the whole group, or at least the ones who embark on the raid of the saviors. Again, it's not subtle. Michelle, who seems intended as an alternate version of Maggie much as Paula is a dark mirror of Carol, outright says, "you're not the good guys." But at the same time, I like the idea of the show broadening its perspective a bit. We literally see the events at the Saviors' compound from Paula's eyes, and it's not necessarily a pretty picture.
The Walking Dead has been toying with this idea since beginning the Hilltop/Negan storyline, and it's fruitful territory. It's cold and nearly heartless when Rick takes out Primo without his enemy barely getting a sentence out before there's a bullet in his brain. To this end, the best scene in the episode is the first, that shows a group no less capable than Rick's looking on with horror but determination at what our heroes have accomplished. But it peters out quickly when the episode tries to draw a moral equivalency while making the Saviors we see too thinly-drawn to feel truly sympathetic.
But as I often say about The Walking Dead, there's the germ of a good idea there. I appreciate the concept of Carol as an agent of change, of someone who's lived by the philosophy of doing whatever must be done, no matter the cost, it protect yourself and your own, who's disillusioned by where that's led her and having serious qualms about the group as whole adopting that view. This episode was a weak attempt to draw out that internal conflict in Carol, but hopefully the way it tied that idea to the larger theme of whether our heroes are really worth rooting for or if, instead, they've become something different, something cruel out there in jungle, will lead to better and brighter things.
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Very good review, I wish I can bookmark a review on Trakt. I agree that in the end Paula only serves as a Carol parallel, being dead in the same episode where she is introduced. Same with Molly, whose bits of the character I also find interesting.
I'm rarely disturbed by what I see on television anymore... but damn... that police station scene was intense!
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@albertic0 I think you don't watch much...
Naomi's jump through the vacuum was the most retarded scene ever. Aren't you supposed to get immediately sucked out into space if a compartment loses pressure instead of softly floating away? Ridiculous...
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@m4cc someone explained it for you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jy0299W67cU
This fight for Ilus doesn't make sense.
It's an entire planet but they are killing each other over less than an acre for fucks sake.
One side take the western hemisphere and the other side take the eastern hemisphere.loading replies
@phug you're missing the point. That's what you got if what you care is about money. Nobody gives a fuck about territory - it's about identity.
Belters, especially the OPA strain, think once they got taken away, they wouldn't be able to return. It's a result of years of oppression - they became paranoid because that's what the Inner always did in the past. Earthers, meanwhile, thinks that they're some universe-wide police which can regulate what can and can't people do. They're not arguing over some territory on the planet for the deposit. They're arguing about who can claim the whole damn planet. A planet to call home.
If you spend some time to actually think about it this whole situation reflects the way real-world US deals with the situation in the Middle East. Earth is US. I thought it was obvious for The Expanse intended audience from the start.
I have said it before and I have to confirm this again...Holden and Naomi remain the weakest characters (as they actually are in the book too) that when the plot puts them in the background like in this episode, the show works much better. In my opinion the tv version managed to fix some weaknesses of the books, so maybe screenplayers could have tried to make the story more collective and leave Holden and Naomi in a not too prominent position. The first season was kind of different since there was Miller around, a much more interesting character.
One thing's for sure, since her storyline took steam, Bobbie is totally stealing this show. She made Draper TV versione much more intense than her book counterpart.loading replies
@goonie you're right about Miller. He's still my favorite character so far. Brash and unexpected, yet very resolute about his goals.
I sat through the whole season waiting for things to get interesting and they never really did. I was so bored the whole time. This show is just way too slow for me, I guess.
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@abtr this is not an action-packed, flashy superhero series like Arrow or Agents of Shield; it has elements of noir and hard sci-fi, which is more careful and can be kinda slow burn. Maybe yeah it's just not for you.
The beginning of the episode left me wishing we could've seen more of this side of Star Wars: regular stormtroopers doing their job, getting into action, and all the unseen dynamics rarely mentioned in the mainstream film trilogies. We did have something in that vein: Republic Commando explored the lives of elite Republic clone troopers; Jedi Academy had us follow the lives of youngling under tutelage of Luke's academy; the original Battlefront showed us the transitioning of a republic to an empire through the eyes of the soldiers.
It's the lives of the mundane, the less than extraordinary, yet still gripping and intriguing. They let us dive deeper to the world of Star Wars beyond the flashy buzzing of lightsabers and spectacles of the magical force.
The Mandalorian wished it could be one of those. Unfortunately, it failed terribly.
In episode 5, @ShrimpBoatSteve has said that the series has became too predictable, and I agree - the finale shows how predictable the whole season is. https://trakt.tv/comments/264475
After the long flashback which most parts we've already seen in previous episodes - seemingly making the scenes feels almost like a filler - The Mandalorian episode 8 seems reluctant to set their foot to the ground with its notable world-building as previously seen in Eps 7 and Eps 1 to 3. As I have previously said, after everyone gangs on The Mando (Eps 7), Baby Yoda/Little One's background (who Baby Yoda is, why is he wanted, what the Imperial remnants wanted to do with him, etc) remains unresolved. As the episode shows us Moff Gideon rising with a darksaber in hand, yet another reference moment: every substance the show can possibly offer will be dealt only in Season 2 (or, worse, more).
Stormtroopers in Star Wars have been infamous for their terribly inaccurate shots, but in this episode it feels like their incompetency is amplified to the point of parody and, of course, plot armors. Scout troopers - which is supposed to be snipers - can't shoot droid right in front of their eyes. Instead of coming in squads, troopers only come individually (incinerators burning the building, a few troopers slaughtered by the blacksmith, a few others guarding the tunnel, and the most stupid of all, Moff Gideon waiting for nightfall just for no reason) which makes for a convenient plot armors for our heroes to trek on their way.
Of course, there are casualties - what is a story without something seemingly at a stake? - but it is nothing more than devices to delay the heroes from their trek. Taking cues from Eowyn's "I am no man" of Lord of the Rings fame, in less than moment-defining fashion IG-11, which himself came as a sort of droid ex machina, said that it is no "living being" while resurrecting The Mando from fatal injuries, remedied every possible threat with its healing devices.
Antagonists can be dumb, but there is a limit to dumbness that can suspend audience's disbelief. This episode has antagonist almost feels like they are intentionally dumb and there is nothing really at a stake when everything can be easily remedied.
This episode is not the worst, certainly, as the action sequence is flashy and satisfying. The one near ending where The Mando utilizes a neat jet jump is clever and actually can show the extent Star Wars can be when the director wanted to think creatively beyond the force. Knights of the Old Republic and the aptly named Star Wars Bounty Hunter played with clever tricks similar to this once a while, and the trick doesn't feel cheap as they stand on a very good storytelling.
The Mandalorian's flashy action, regardless, seems to serve only as explicit fanservice - a style over substance.
There are plenty of action, which, by itself, is quite well-done. The consistently hardly imposing threats, unfortunately, dull down the possible thrill those scenes can offer - in a typical corny action heroes such as Gerard Butler's character in Has Fallen trilogy. The scene, for example, with The Blacksmith let us peek into the martial arts capability a Mandalorian can exhibit. But the rather plot armor of incompetent stormtroopers leave no stake at hand; the martial arts dexterity looks more like a cheap imitation of main trilogies of Jedi's acrobatic feats.
Redemption ultimately ends with nothing to be redeemed about, as the people in this show seems to be forever clumsy. From start to finish, everyone made questionable decisions. Nobody blasted the Mando's group with that large amount of stormtroopers. Nobody checked whether Moff Gideon is dead when the fighter was down (Gideon also miraculously survive the crash), with Carga, a supposedly veteran bounty hunter, lightheartedly saying they are already free of the Empire's grasp.
Everything people said in this episode, just like many episodes prior, are not crafted as if the actors were having human conversation. They were rushed by time - they seemingly appear to be set in motion by the plot's demands, to say X so Y happens; to say A when B moment happened.
This episode almost feels like a filler to conclude the dragging episodes this season has been. Screenwriting-wise, this whole season is nothing but bait-and-switch to justify next season(s).
There is much to be said about this kind of terrible business model, where series is written with nothing exactly in mind but to find reasons to continue producing the franchise - the same business model Disney has been using on their MCU franchise and Star Wars films/spinoffs - but the crowds of gladly willing moms awing for Baby Yoda and nerd dads geeking over Star Wars reference doesn't leave enough rooms for those commentaries.
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@shrimpboatsteve precisely. The stand off makes no sense at all, which is too bad because Moff Gideon's arrival on previous episode was already quite sensational. IG getting his droids ex machina there and the incinerator trooper coming alone... nothing of that makes sense.
Season 2, I'm not sure if I'm going to watch it considering season 1's quality. As for some good shows, since you liked Mr. Robot, I guess you've watched Utopia, Fargo, and Electric Dreams? There are also The Expanse and Altered Carbon, which I quite liked.
