Well... what an ending.
The Talk scene was nearly perfect and also hurt me in all the right ways. Could have being even more mean-spirited if Mappa left in the meanest jabs at Armin - "You weren't soft like this before. Your judgment always led us to an answer... But now, all you can say is, "let's talk"... You're absolutely useless." and Mikasa - "What I'm saying is that the REAL Mikasa disappeared in that mountain cabin, at 9-years old. Leaving only you behind, ever faithful <..> slave:
https://official-complete-2.eorzea.us/manga/Shingeki-No-Kyojin/0112-021.png
https://official-complete-2.eorzea.us/manga/Shingeki-No-Kyojin/0112-025.png
Thank god Mappa cut the host talk, through. It was confusing as hell and naturally fans blow it out of proportions even more. It was a mess. I didn't know one could make the scene where Mikasa holds Armin down even more heartbreaking than it was in the manga, but they managed it somehow.
Levi vs Zeke part alot 3
The good. Well, the good parts were great actually. Voice acting, it was as emotional as the Talk, I enjoyed some creative shots of the fight, hell even funny parts from the manga were left in hooray!
The bad. Good god who the hell choose this song?! No, a song with lyrics in general and it was playing so loud... ugh. Music didn't add anything to the moment. WIT did amazing job animating Levi's fight scenes and Mappa is no match in that regard. Some shots that looked creative tried to hide lack of powerful moments, but ultimately heavy burden was put on the voice actors to carry the scene (but they did a great job anyway). Also feels like Levi had more expression during all of it in the manga. Regardless, it was the first fight in season 4 that didn't meet my personal expectations which is kinda worrisome for the part 2 of Season 4... well, we will see I guess.
Btw, the "censorship steam" is back baby! WIT couldn't be more proud looking at the scene of Zeke's injuries ;)
https://64.media.tumblr.com/3878ebbce9edae43086b41970bb28a59/8ef9c787a82d5ce8-96/s640x960/ce935da92612a7dfe58884698c71fcbc93472322.jpg
Not yet shown ending
Who knows. If they switched back to a different storyline after the fight like it happened in the manga overall impression of the episode would dip, imho. BUT if they didn't and ended it where I think they would... oh boy, I think a lot of flaws could be forgotten just for this bold move.
As a giant sidenote.
It does feels like Ackerman's lore is retconned somewhat in anime.
I assumed that the previously cutted info would be used in The Talk scene by Eren. But not only nothing was added to it, some info from the Talk scene was cut short on the lore, too.
It started back in season 3 with unimportant hints getting cut. Like Zeke calling Levi a monster:
https://official-complete-2.eorzea.us/manga/Shingeki-No-Kyojin/0083-014.png
https://official-complete-2.eorzea.us/manga/Shingeki-No-Kyojin/0083-015.png
Before the attack on Marley we had Zeke explaining why they should be extra careful with the future attack on Paradise island. And he mentions Ackerman clan as byproduct of titan science:
https://official-complete-2.eorzea.us/manga/Shingeki-No-Kyojin/0093-019.png
Which also sort of explains why Porco specifically called Levi "Ackerman" in that moment.
In The Talk we get even more detailed and over explained to be honest description of their power:
"A bloodline that could partly manifest the strength of a titan while in human form."
https://official-complete-2.eorzea.us/manga/Shingeki-No-Kyojin/0112-022.png
End of my essay)
Can someone die out of sheer excitement?!?! What an episode!!
7.2/10. A good episode centered on the difficulties of being a woman, especially in the 1990s. Again, this is American Crime Story, so none of this is going to be especially subtle, but the way that Clark was criticized, in her divorce proceedings and in the OJ trial, for the care she provided for her kids, the way that she was attacked, in the media and in her own office, for her appearance and demeanor, and as a final insult, to have nude photos of her released to the press, was all just horrifying. Sarah Paulson does a great job, showing the strength behind Clark and the way that everything gradually chipped away at that strength simply because she has two X-chromosomes. She's the MVP of this episode, and maybe the series for how she brings life and depth to a season scrounging for it much of the time through her performance alone.
Still, there's a weird C-plot about the media coverage of the case, which isn't done especially well. There's something about this show where, like the Faye Resnik scenes in the prior episode, it just throws in a handful of moments centered on some interesting sidenote to the case without really integrating it into the proceedings. Similarly, the bits with F. Lee Bailey and his N-word strategy were a little too on the nose, especially with the bizarre, overly showy direction and editing when he was cross-examining Furman.
But overall, Clark's struggles and Paulson's performance carry the day here. Her struggle is a moving and in some ways dispiriting one, and the episode builds the confluence of events that lead her to break down nicely. I also enjoyed her relationship with Chris Darden which continues to be a highlight of the show. Their little late night dance in the office was adorable (if probably apocryphal) and as much as Paulson sold the transition from sexy self-confidence to utter defeat when her makeover didn't go over as she hoped, she also sold the sunshine in the darkness that is Chris's support amazingly well. The two of them (plus Sterling K Brown's Cochran) are the only things holding this show together (give or take Bruce Greenwood and Kato Kailin) and so giving Paulson's Clark a spotlight does well to elevate the proceedings over some of the prior doldrums.
I actually liked the ending. To me most characters went full circle and had a fitting ending. I understand that some people don't like it and I think that season 08 was rushed to much and not build up enough. But the actual ending felt good to me and fitting with the characters...
- Jon: Doesn't want to be king and has said this since s01 (he's just a bastard) and his (Ned) Stark level of honor has always been what defines him.
- Arya: Since s01 didn't want to be a lady and although I loved her love interest with Gendry I found it fitting for her to leave.
- Bran: Sees and knows all as the 3 eyed raven and has done so much in the series, such a big character in the books and he knew he couldn't be lord because he was going to be king. Do I think they explained it enough in the series? No, that could've been handled beter but still a fitting end for him.
- Jaime dieing with his true love (Cersei) because they belonged together was fitting for me as well. He knows his sister is bad and poisonous but he feels he doesn't deserve a good live with Brienne and will always love his sister. The way HOW they died should've been beter
- Sansa: Queen of the North? Hell yeah, obvious.... The North Remembers...
- Tyrion: Fitting end, he knows things and drinks wine...
-Danny: Since season 1 was obvious to me she wasn't 100% a good person and was capable of horrific things (like crucifieing the slavers without any emotion... Couple that with Dragons and losing all the people she loved and trusted.... Obvious to me she was going to become totally cray cray. So her ending was a proper one to me. They should've perhaps elaborated more on this because can imagine that to some viewer it was a bit sudden and out of the blue....
To me it feels like some people just hate it because the ending was different than what they had in mind or had immagined...
I was not pleased with few episodes of this season. But I would be lying if I said that I didn't enjoy many scenes in this episode. I don't hate the events that happened in it unlike many. I loved many things as well as the soundtracks, the acting, the CGI, special visual effects, and all the works. They were good, in my opinion.
Jon Snow heads North, leaving his Targaryen identity, as Tormund Giantsbane once told him, "You've got the North in you, the real North." He gave our good boy a pat, finally. He went north of the wall, though, with the freefolk. Not much point of Castle Black anymore, and it was even barely manned, so it makes sense. The ending seemed just, to me.
But one thing I am disappointed at, is that we never knew what Tyrion did with the honeycomb and the jackass at the brothel. :laughing:
Technically it was one of the best episodes, for me. I'm at peace with how things ended.
I really can't wait for the spin-off, by the way.
I also want to see another spin-off about Arya Stark's adventures. I'd pay good money for it.
I grew up watching this series. Thank you Game of Thrones. Easily one of my favourite TV series, if not the best one of them all. I will miss this series.
[7.2/10] This is the definition of a piece-moving episode. Rather than uniting every story around an overall theme, or letting any single character have even a mini-arc within the episode, this is just about checking in with pretty much all of the main characters and moving them to a different place, more literally than figuratively.
You can halfway ferret out the theme of finding someone who looks familiar, but who’s in a changed state that makes them different, but that is, admittedly, something of a reach on my part, and at most a salve of an episode that is more a patchwork quilt than a unified whole. But the patches are mostly fine, some even quite good, even where they don’t really have much to do with one another in an outing that comes off like an interstitial.
The most obvious of these is the interludes with the new, ruthless Teddy. After last week’s heartless upgrade, Teddy is now ready, willing, and able to shoot folks when they’re no longer useful to him, to show blatant disregard for the safety and well-being of humans, and to seem to have no compunction about taking life whatsoever.
It’s an interesting, if heavy-handed shift for Teddy who, in his way, thanks Dolores for “fixing” him. Seeing the good natured guy turn bad as though the Krusty the Klown doll’s switch was flipped from “good” to “evil” is a different kind of heel turn than, say, the implied slow burn path for William. It seems to be building to a heavily signposted “what hell hath I wrought?” from Dolores, who looks at her new cold-hearted beau with a sense of trepidation and maybe even a shade of regret.
As with most of this episode, it feels like that exists more to set up something else down the line rather than be its own thing here, but hey, the robo-revolutionaries have commandeered a train and are headed for the Mesa, so at least some stuff’s about to go down, y’all.
That isn’t the only scene in the episode of a young woman confronting a formerly decent, now ruthless gunslinger. The highlight of the episode is a conversation between latter-day William, in his The Man in Black guise, and his daughter, Emily.
It’s hard to put my finger on why, but the best I can offer is that the scene comes off as a bit of truth in the midst of these otherwise outsized events. There is a realness to the conversation between father and daughter here, a believability both to the way the taciturn William offers matter of fact assessments and resignations about the way his daughter acted, and Emily sees through his bullshit and calls him out on his “suicide by robot” mission out here.
It’s the little details, like William confusing his daughter’s feelings on elephants with his wife’s, or the way that Emily sort of half laughs at her dad’s misconceptions, that make the relationship seem lived-in and worthy of the baggage that the show tries to hang on it. It’s the first time we see William smile -- not smirk or offer some half-crooked upturned lip -- but genuinely smile, at the thought of some measure of reconciliation with his daughter.
That makes it all the more impactful (if not exactly shocking) that he goes back on his word to bail on Westworld and instead leaves his daughter behind. That too seems to be a choice to move the character where he needs to be, but it does so on the back of deepening the relationship between two characters, in a way that shines a light on who each of them are, which is the least you can ask for from a piece-moving episode like “Phase Space.”
There’s also plenty of raw plotty material. Hale uploads the contents of Papa Abernathy’s brain to the folks at Delos, who then finally agree to send a rescue team. Stubbs sees Abernathy bolted into place and seems to have second thoughts about the cruelty shown to him. And the rescue team arrives, playing the “we’re in charge now” game with Stubbs as a commonwealth-accented brute hits the usual gruff enforcer notes. None of it is especially compelling -- as it feels like the show dutifully going through plot points with one of Westworld’s dullest characters as the anchor -- but again, it sets certain pieces of the narrative where they need to be, which seems to be the overall goal of this episode.
“Phase Space” also cleans up the remaining loose ends from Maeve’s adventures in Shogunland, in what feels like more of a post-script to last week’s episode than a vital part of this one. But regardless, the Samurai business is one of the most exciting parts of the series -- both visually and thematically -- and so watching the ronin have a tense duel, or Akane tear Sakura’s heart out, or the pair of them sending Maeve’s own words about choosing one’s own fate back at her, it’s just nice to be along for the ride.
I’d be lying if I said that sights like Akane burning Sakura’s heart, or the power of her and the ronin laying down their swords and settling, or Maeve bidding farewell to her counterpart after that old movie poetry didn’t reignite my passion to go watch a bunch of old Samurai movies. Some of this may feel a little perfunctory, like material they just didn’t have space for in the last episode, but it’s still damn good.
I was less enamored with Maeve finally finding her daughter. The twist that Maeve was replaced with another host who fills the mother role in the homesteader story was a bit too predictable, if nevertheless jarring in how you can feel the reveal’s effect on Maeve. The Ghost Nation warriors showing up right as Maeve arrives feels too convenient, but given how clockwork this show likes to make things, maybe there’s some explanation. And while Thandie Newton acts the hell out of it, Maeve’s monologue about her daughter’s dolls, and how the mother doll will never let anything bad happen to the daughter doll, is way way way too on the nose.
On the whole, for a reunion that the show has been building up for nearly a whole season at this point, there wasn’t enough in the moment to do anything but underwhelm. Maeve’s whole “I have to do this alone” bit is mildly understandable, but comes off contrived and cliché, and the confluence of all these events is just too perfect, too neat, to be meaningful despite all the build up to it.
Last but not least in this frankenstein of stories, we see Elsie and Bernard realize that something internal to Westworld’s computer systems is fighting QA’s attempts to get things back online, and is fending off those attacks and incursions with creativity and variation rather than with some rote form of protection. They trace it to a simulation within Westworld called “The Cradle” which requires manual access.
Most of this feels like exposition and plot position, that mainly serves to deliver our tease for the next episode. “Phase Space” gets a bit creative, showing Bernard’s Matrix-like experience in the digital version of Sweetwater in letterbox to distinguish it from the real world. And, naturally, he comes across Ford, who’s the source of the system fighting back. Duuuun duuuun duuuuun. It is, again, a bit of a predictable twist, and I’m not exactly excited to have Ford’s riddle-ridden soliloquies back in the offing. But hey, it’s a cool moment, and especially in piecemeal episode like these, that becomes what Westworld runs on.
Again, as an assemblage of scenes, “Phase Space” isn’t bad. Bits like William’s conversation with Emily, or Maeve’s farewell to Akane play like gangbusters. But in this arrangement, the episode never rises above being the sum of its parts. Some of those parts are good, some of those parts are bad, but all of them are the lesser for being stitched together rather than the natural pieces of some greater whole.
The man who rode that train was built weak and born to fail. You fixed him. Now forget about it. Teddy 2.0
Dolores wanting to change everything but herself, Maeve wanting to change herself to influence the world.
What we learned in Phase Space
Dolores is programming and testing and Arnold bot
Or maybe, that's not her (or her cr4-dl consciousness). That's Ford. He needs to have her appearance b/c that's what the real Arnold knew about that conversation.
William thinking his daughter was a host sent by Ford. ROFL!!!
Of course, he was testing her to see if she was a real or host version of Emily sent by Ford as part of the game
Climate control is working
More about the Cradle
Cradle—spelled CR4-DL is "the simulation technology that stores and tests all of our storylines" and ensures customers "get the immersive and dynamic experience [they] deserve." So it's the way Delos test-drives its experiences. Bernard describes it as a "backup," and Elsie calls it a "hive mind" where all the host's consciousnesses are "alive.
Japanese Armistice is sticking with Maeve and the gang
William and Emily's relationship has been...difficult
William confused his wife with his daughter when recounting the story about the elephants in Raj World. Does that say something about his family life, a simple slip of the tongue, or is it something else like MIB is a Host?
Maeve's daughter has new parents
Who didn't see Maeve meeting her replacement? Did she think her daughter was all alone? That was typical of Lee to omit that little piece of information. And what is the Ghost Nation's game?
Ghost Nation wanted Maeve to come with them. Since they protect the guests, there was also more to Maeve than simply being a host.
Akecheta is awake & probably sees that Maeve is too!
Teddy 2.0 is Stone Cold
Dolores is going to regret reprogramming Teddy in the coming episodes.
Her reactions were so funny "oh shit what have I done!"
Teddy is aware that Dolores reprogrammed him. I feel that will be important later.
Ford is inside the Cradle
Ford's back, or at least an approximation of his consciousness in the Cradle. We all suspected Ford would return as a Host despite the flat-out denials from Anthony Hopkins and Jonathan Nolan & co.. They pretty much telegraphed his return over the season (he's in the system, briefly surfacing in Hosts e.g. young Ford), but Episode 4 all but confirmed it.
Dolores and Maeve storylines ** is not interesting at all. They're currently paper thin and taking their sweet time to go anywhere.**
The Man In Black's daughter who we know nothing about is a far more compelling character.
The Cradle Is Capable Of So Much More Than We Expected
The Cradle, in essence, is a server that stores memories and consciousness for retrieval. Like a file cabinet, the hosts’ “data” is copied and contained within the server, and can be accessed to run theoretical or training simulations on the robots. The main function of the Cradle, though, is to act as a backup for each of the intricately-crafted hosts; a way for Delos to preserve the work that went into detailing their appearances, their preferences, their mannerisms, the very things that make them so human. Think of it as the Cloud that stores your phone pics.
Those pearls, it turns out, are the container for the hosts’ consciousnesses. But the Cradle itself send commands to the parks, not unlike the way the Matrix papers over glitches with deja vu. And the implications of this functionality go way beyond just data storage. It means that the Cradle itself can run simulations or disrupt the flow of time —if it has a programmer (the host) to program a server farm (the Cradle), illustrated by Bernard getting off the train at exactly the spot he needed to be. The Cradle doesn’t appear to create simulations without a host’s consciousness to guide it.
Do we have a host in the Cradle? We sure do, and because Bernard just uploaded his brain pearl into the Cradle, it could mean that everything we’ve seen in season 2 thus far — the multiple timelines, the weird ways that the characters are interacting with him — are just a simulation. This totally mind-bending but plausible theory was put forth by YouTuber HaxDogma, and in a 10-minute video he makes the case that Bernard has hacked his way into the Cradle, and everything is running from his point of view. In other words, it’s as though we’re viewing everything like Neo did at the end of the first Matrix: as a source code that can be manipulated.
Or (and this is even more sinister), perhaps Robert Ford has been in the Cradle all along, pulling the strings, and driving wedges between Dolores and Maeve with her new powers.
What a fucking masterpiece. The dialogue, the acting: outstanding, especially the MIB slow reveal. 30 minutes after the finale and I'm still speechless. Everything was brilliant. That smile the WIB had when he realized that the hosts were actually able to fight back was just perfect. No one has ever been so happy so get shot. But he has to survive. At least he found the meaning he was looking for.
And wtf, this whole time Ford has been on the side of the hosts? This has actually been the best part of the finale. It was a nice unpredicted twist. That's why he did all the things he did. He didn't want anyone to destroy his beautiful creatures. It wasn't that he didn't want the humans to feel sorry for the hosts, but the other way around. Holy mindfuck. That's why he kept on talking to Old Billy and that pianist. That's why they were all dressed up and not naked.
And I'm so glad that Maeve's arc is designed by Ford in order to get rid of his enemies. So Dolores and Maeve are the ones that are really conscious, or is Bernard too? I really like the fact that Maeve decides to stay and that Dolores shoots Ford because she freely decides to. However, what if everything is scripted and Maeve came back because, as Bernard said "once you reach the main..." (mainland?), she was scripted to?
I really hope Dolores didn't kill Ford, but a host version. That handshake between Ford and Bernard felt weird, and that zoom in, suspicious. Why if that robot being created in episode 7 was in fact Ford's replacement?
Felix's little existencial crisis was one of the funniest parts for me, ike, am I even real? Does existence really exist? and Armistice's first time with an automatic weapon. I didn't know I needed that. I think Sylvester is still waiting in that lab.
Now wait until 2018. I will freeze all motor functions now and bring myself back online for season 2. It is going to be insane: multiple parks, the hosts full on terminator, and the board dead. The hosts run the show now.
This episode was unbelievably strong, brilliant, so much depth and emotion, the acting. The way everything came full circle. Truly stunning. I guess I shall ‘freeze all motor functions’ till 2018
Evan Rachel Wood with Ed Harris, those scenes, “his path will lead him back”, were so strong.
That scene of Maeve being created is gorgeous! Wow. Those awards for technical achievements better be coming!
So William became The Man in Black on his quest for Delores. "He found himself" - This montage/narrative reveal is really great. Fascinating how much love/affection/or care can make someone do the craziest of things.
"I really ought to thank you, Delores, you helped me find myself" - I loved how the showcased the reveals, the time periods together, the scenes being crossing together, the camera work, the music, so beautiful (reminded of the Jon Snow reveal from Game of Thrones).
"Time undoes even the mightiest of creatures" OMG Evan Rachel Wood was so powerful in this moment. The way she spoke of walking on his ashes, it was stunning .That dialogue (reminded me of that which Sansa said to Ramsey).
"Take me to where the mountains meet the sea” - This dialogue tonight!
"How many are there like me?" - The way Maeve looked out the window, the pain in her performance, it was truly breathtaking.
“I wanted them to be free, free to fight back” - What The Man in Black said was interesting, having a reaction, for them to fight back, without that freedom, the game is pointless because you know the outcome.
Seeing Delores die in Teddy’s arms and it all being a show, it’s haunting and beautiful. All of this is truly a play, the hosts are the supporting cast and Dr. Ford is the orchestrating of all of this. Truly Shakespearian.
Loved Armistice and Hectors reactions to the guns :D
Seeing Maeve and Hectors saying goodbyes were really moving, “see you in the next life” :(
"What he had lost his son, he tried to create in you" - My heart, the maze too, representing a child’s toy, the representation of a child's innocence. This is too beautifully touching and thought to provoke. It's all so simple sometimes.
It’s always suffering, isn’t it, even for us humans :(
The closing music was gorgeous. Maeve turning back because she saw a mother and a child, a reflection of herself, her humanity coming through :(
That cliffhanger!! I am so heartbroken we have to wait so long!
