This feels much more like mid season episode. That's not saying it was a bad one. Quite the opposite. I had a lot of good laughs and a lot of smiles.
One small point of critique: the whole Lysella story was too predictable. I love the dialogue between her and Kelly. It's obvious where that's aimed at. But why not show her the simulation earlier ? Could've made her understand and accept without all the back and forth.
As for the Clair/Issac relationship - who would've thought it would end in marriage when that started way back. But it works, it makes sense and it doesn't feel forced.
Final thoughts on the season:
"Future Unknown" refers as much to the episode as to the show itself. There still is no news about a renewal. It would be a loss to not have another season. I'm sure they could come up with interesting stories. Ed's daughter, his relationship to Kelly, how Claire and Isaac work out, Lysella - there is tons of potential. But they also made sure we get closure if it ends here. I would miss the characters as they have grown on me. I want to see them again and learn more about them. Experience some more adventures with them. That's a feeling no show has given me for quite some time.
Please come back.
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@finfan I finished watching this series again. I forgot about Lysella staying, I don't know why.
You care about the characters so it's a nice episode where you feel you are spending time with your friends, having good laughs.
Almost a year passed since this episode aired and no news about season 4 yet. The most important story left behind is the daughter of Ed and Teleya. I hope to see her reunited with her father soon.
It's drifting into ridicule again.
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@finfan Yeah, this was a pretty rough episode.
@finfan There's no guarantee that all operatives are clones. Ventress is confirmed in the trailers, and book readers have pointed out that the timeline of these episodes almost overlaps the timeline of Ventress dying and being resurrected (new canon). What if the operative program is how that happens?
Additionally, that ship this operative is using just screams lone Sith Apprentice.
I will be surprised if it is not Ventress. I will be VERY surprised if it's Tech. It would cheapen his sacrifice too much, it doesn't feel like something Filoni would do. But, like you said, we'll see.
This show should’ve ended two seasons ago, it was good when they appeared in Clone Wars, the “m-count” is ridiculous, they don’t even date to mention the complete name, and a clone having that?… please
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@troop3r85 I mean, paying attention has never been the strong suit of people ready to dismiss something before they've even watched it. Omega's sample didn't have an m-count, just her genes would facilitate an m-count transfer
Are lighting guys in short supply or something? I can't see shit this episode. :person_shrugging:
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@finfan Wouldn't surprise me if that was their reasoning. I already don't like the show, but it might help if I was able to see what was going on.
Wait a minute: this was produced well before the final season of Clone Wars. So it was already established that Rex removed his inhibitor chip and others did as well ? And he was talking about the siege of Mandalore as well. Then I must say I'm glad I'm only watching this now because it would have lessens the impact a bit had I known that.
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@finfan agreed - it's nice to get to watch it in chronological order :)
Funny how now the Empire Remnant has a secret underground resistance against the New Republic. How the tables have turned.
This episode was way better in terms of storytelling but it left me very frustrated. I know that the Mandalorians are not likely to win if they want to keep the mythology. But just for once I'd like to see them come out on top. Gideon has become a bit ridicolous. He's the archetype of a bad guy. He was more interesting when he wasn't flying around as a Vader look-alike. I hate to see Vizla die but I should've seen that one coming because I really grew to like him. Grogu inside IG ? Come-on, he's a Force user. Despite the fact he choose not to train with Luke he still has the ability, no ? And we still must have a monster, doesn't we ?
Now, those are personal and, yes, biased points on my behalf. Like I said it was a great episode as such. In the end I see it as a win for the author if he invokes those reactions from me. There were also moments that gave me serious goosebumps. Like when Bo told them what happened between her and Gideon and subsequent how Din told her why he's following her. The talk about Thrawn didn't surprise me. I expected that pretty much from episode one forward.
Only one episode left and I hope there'll be some silver lining.
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Funny how now the Empire Remnant has a secret underground resistance against the New Republic. How the tables have turned.
The Rebel Alliance to Restore the Empire?
Review by FinFan
I am really rather tired of sentient holograms and this whole oppression thing. And the Doctor always in the middle, taking sides, than seeing how he was wrong.
First off, when they created Moriaty it was a "technical glitch" caused by a slip of the tongue. You could already argue how the Enterprise computer created a sentient, self-aware hologramm. But it's scifi so you let it stand.
Than they created the EMH, which makes sense. A computer programm, meant to do certain tasks, put into a holo matrix. But, you just leave it running long enough, give it some subroutines and memory, and it magically develops a personality. And now we discover sentient or self aware hologramms everywhere.
With the Doctor it is the quest to find humanity, much like they did with Data. I can get behind that. The rest is just ridiculous and serves no real purpose. And a religious, fanatic hologram who sees himself as some kind of Messiah ? That's going overboard.
The positives of this story is that we again pick up consequences of Janeways actions because everything that happened here comes out of her decisions. I was actually surprised how they talked about how often they gave away replicator tech and stuff. I thought that was a absolute no-go.
In any case, you could probably do another seven season show that just deals with those kind of consequences.
You know, I'd actually watch that.loading replies
I agree, when she said we’ve given away replicators I was thinking, um when did you do that?? Also haven’t they figured out yet that holograms mimicking sentience is not sentience., the programs are just really advanced so it looks like sentience, but it’s not.
Episode was OK, although at times I wasn't sure if this is pro or anti PC.
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It's like when some people watch The Boys and root for Homelander, thinking he's the hero. Good satire walks that line well.
Just let me get two things out of the way I think were weak storytelling.
First, putting the drive on the hub was the stupidest thing to do as it could only lead to her getting caught. It also was illogical as it was clear that they would just override it and/or claim it as false. Granted she didn't know about the Janitor room but she knew there was surveilance everywhere and because of that might reach the conclusion that all those feeds had to be watched somewhere. But the story needs to go on so I'll take it.
Second, its hard to believe that they didn't inspect the stuff they brought to Juliette or they would have found the note. Even not knowing what it meant they would not have let it through. Plus, from a storyelling point of view it was giving too much away. Would have been better to not show it. Instead they could insert a scene when Juliette is about to break down to explain that she didn't die. And speaking of dying, Where are all the others that went out? Does someone actually go out to collect the bodies ?
Now, for the big reveal at the end I have to say I didn't see that coming. After making us believe (and I did) that it is safe outside, not only do we learn it is not, but there are literally dozens of silos out there. Does that mean the whole of mankind lives underground ? My guess is that each one thinks they are the only one and each one does have someone taking care that it stays like that. But we still don't have an idea about why ?
There is one thing I noticed that I want to point out. When Juliette told Holland about the door below he seem genuinely surprised. As if he didn't knew. That was the moment he ended the conversation. Just saying.
So, I don't know the books but from reading elsewhere I understand we barely scratched the surface of the story. I wonder how slow they will go with this one. The second season is already confirmed but thre is always the chance of not getting a third, or forth, or however many they need to play this out.
I sure hope we're not getting left hanging in the air atsome point.
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@great_vc Definitely right ! He didn't know for sure !
This is not the way... this is the destination. This is new-generation Star Wars at its finest.
David Filoni is living his best life.
Can you imagine if Filoni had been in charge of Obi-Wan? Maybe they would have bothered to de-age Hayden that time.
I cannot wait to see the reactions to this one (Kyle Katarn is going to have a conniption fit), and I cannot wait to laugh at all the low ratings and negative comments. Wonder what straws they're going to grasp at this time...
Edit: Personal attacks it is. :expressionless:
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@aeronmelon It's really interesting that your comment praising this episode have no mention of anything about the story, other than they deaged an actor. Instead the bulk of it is about strawmaning everyone who dare to criticize it.
Tells a lot about the quality of the story of the episode and the biases of the people praising it. :)
Sabine getting stabbed by lightsaber: I am fine, tis but a flesh wound.
Ahsoka on top of ship in space: This is fine, I am going to do some acrobatic jumps in space, fall back on the ship and prevent the enemy from blowing us up using my lightsabers.
Ahsoka falling on the ocean: Well, I am dead... Time for some memberberries and time travelling!loading replies
@FinFan Yeah I get what you mean. I myself am not a fan of all the cop out Star Wars is doing. It completely removes any impact of the deaths. However, I don’t think they’ll bring back Anakin from the dead. They’re probably just going to have an inspirational conversation and call it a day. It’s also possible that Ahsoka only ended up there after falling off the cliff because she was originally saved in the World between Worlds. Maybe it actually is closed but not for her
Lame. I regret that I stuck with this show.
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We regret that you stuck with this show too.
The action sequence was running a bit long but otherwise another solid episode.
I'm surprised there wasn't another way to relieve the steam pressure. Was that just a story tool to generate tension? You would think the builders would incorporate a way to make repairs in case they are needed. Otherwise they were either pretty sure the generator would run forever or they never anticipated it runs so long. Weird.
Did you notice the moment they switched to the back-up the screen showed a healthy, green environment outside ? No coincidence I say.
Bernard is hiding something, he is a much more important player in the tale. Unfortunately I was sure the moment the major opened up to the deputy her clock was running out.loading replies
@finfan The tension building part was how even though Juliette was spraying the water which immediately cooled down the steam it somehow doesn't continue working later on even though all the water she's spraying is still exactly the same as before, plus when they released the steam how quickly the pressure dropped but how slowly the turbine accelerated means they could've just released steam in bursts to keep the pressure steady, or even jam the turbine while the steam is open just a crack, etc. But remember, this has never been done, so nobody had any training, and nobody was thinking clearly either (so I'll forgive the fact Juliette told her shadow that he knows what to do, even though neither of them have ever touched that part of the generator before lol)
One thing is for sure: it was f***ing tense.
Just let me get two things out of the way I think were weak storytelling.
First, putting the drive on the hub was the stupidest thing to do as it could only lead to her getting caught. It also was illogical as it was clear that they would just override it and/or claim it as false. Granted she didn't know about the Janitor room but she knew there was surveilance everywhere and because of that might reach the conclusion that all those feeds had to be watched somewhere. But the story needs to go on so I'll take it.
Second, its hard to believe that they didn't inspect the stuff they brought to Juliette or they would have found the note. Even not knowing what it meant they would not have let it through. Plus, from a storyelling point of view it was giving too much away. Would have been better to not show it. Instead they could insert a scene when Juliette is about to break down to explain that she didn't die. And speaking of dying, Where are all the others that went out? Does someone actually go out to collect the bodies ?
Now, for the big reveal at the end I have to say I didn't see that coming. After making us believe (and I did) that it is safe outside, not only do we learn it is not, but there are literally dozens of silos out there. Does that mean the whole of mankind lives underground ? My guess is that each one thinks they are the only one and each one does have someone taking care that it stays like that. But we still don't have an idea about why ?
There is one thing I noticed that I want to point out. When Juliette told Holland about the door below he seem genuinely surprised. As if he didn't knew. That was the moment he ended the conversation. Just saying.
So, I don't know the books but from reading elsewhere I understand we barely scratched the surface of the story. I wonder how slow they will go with this one. The second season is already confirmed but thre is always the chance of not getting a third, or forth, or however many they need to play this out.
I sure hope we're not getting left hanging in the air atsome point.
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And speaking of dying, Where are all the others that went out? Does someone actually go out to collect the bodies ?
From what I understood, the image on the helmet (and not on the silo's screens) is digitally manipulated, meaning they're all still there, as dead as they can be, just like we see on the silo's screens. Juliette seemed to have felt a body right before she left the previous sheriff's star on the "ground" (you can clearly see the distortion in the image), assuming it was his body, maybe by recalling the approximate location of where he fell when he went out cleaning.
I think something in the suit is keeping Juliette alive, unlike the others (is it the tape?), but most likely not for long (the air doesn't look breathable out there). Which leaves me very, very curious to see how will she stay alive in the second season's premiere.
I also wonder where does that door below lead to, as the final scene didn't seem to show any sort of alternative exit (which was what I assume that door would be, an exit out of the silo). I'm guessing it's a door to other silos.
Just let me get two things out of the way I think were weak storytelling.
First, putting the drive on the hub was the stupidest thing to do as it could only lead to her getting caught. It also was illogical as it was clear that they would just override it and/or claim it as false. Granted she didn't know about the Janitor room but she knew there was surveilance everywhere and because of that might reach the conclusion that all those feeds had to be watched somewhere. But the story needs to go on so I'll take it.
Second, its hard to believe that they didn't inspect the stuff they brought to Juliette or they would have found the note. Even not knowing what it meant they would not have let it through. Plus, from a storyelling point of view it was giving too much away. Would have been better to not show it. Instead they could insert a scene when Juliette is about to break down to explain that she didn't die. And speaking of dying, Where are all the others that went out? Does someone actually go out to collect the bodies ?
Now, for the big reveal at the end I have to say I didn't see that coming. After making us believe (and I did) that it is safe outside, not only do we learn it is not, but there are literally dozens of silos out there. Does that mean the whole of mankind lives underground ? My guess is that each one thinks they are the only one and each one does have someone taking care that it stays like that. But we still don't have an idea about why ?
There is one thing I noticed that I want to point out. When Juliette told Holland about the door below he seem genuinely surprised. As if he didn't knew. That was the moment he ended the conversation. Just saying.
So, I don't know the books but from reading elsewhere I understand we barely scratched the surface of the story. I wonder how slow they will go with this one. The second season is already confirmed but thre is always the chance of not getting a third, or forth, or however many they need to play this out.
I sure hope we're not getting left hanging in the air atsome point.
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There is one thing I noticed that I want to point out. When Juliette told Holland about the door below he seem genuinely surprised. As if he didn't knew. That was the moment he ended the conversation. Just saying.
Yeah i catch that too. I think you are right about this one.
I think that's the first time I saw a loss in any of those car shows.
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@finfan I appreciate that they did that. Because it -was- a rare car worth saving... they just didn't find it in time.
Pretty sure none of those who went outside are dead. That's part of the control mechanism to keep people inside. The people in power are obviously afraid to loose it. They destroyed all evidence of what happened in the past so they can create their own myth. Yeah, I know I'm stating the obvious. Maybe they are even living on the surface themselves and don't want to share ? Maybe the Silo is important for things on the surface to work, part of a machinery ?
But it leaves the question open why no one ever came back.loading replies
@finfan I think the opposite. I think the suits themselves are rigged to kill the people going out to keep up the illusion of the "outside poison" killing them to those watching from the inside.
Ah, man, I really liked Marnes. I had hoped he would get out of this.
Ultimately this episode delivers more question then answers. Something that is rather obvious is that Judicial does not want anyone to find out about the past. For whatever reason this might be. But it's safe to assume that with the way they handeled the murder, everything else is a lie, too. But there have to be people who know the truth.
I'm not sold on Holland being a good guy. His change of heart came too sudden and convinient. Or maybe he is a good guy and knows more and wasn't sure he could trust Nichols ?
How doesn't anyone know what Stars are. How can that be dangerous information ?
One thing is sure, I'm still very much interested in how this plays out.
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@finfan the frequency of him insisting, that he does not want to be mayor, makes me think he actually feels the opposite way. I bet he will try to make everything in his powers happen to make sure he stays mayor.
Shout by FinFan
That probably explains why that POW wanted to be killed and why the Skitters care for the children. They may suffer the same fate.
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I’m re-watching this series (although I don’t recall much) and I’m throughly enjoying your comments on each episode. I agree. I couldn’t figure out why they would show some caring while nesting/sleeping but then just kill a bunch. Seems they are also enslaved by the two legged ones.
Many brave men gave their lives for a system that wouldn't even recognize their sacrifices just so that it could uphold the image of being unfailable.
"Our power comes from the perception of our power"
They couldn't even understand that said perception already had gaping holes for the world to look through.
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@finfan - Right! It's heartbreaking. Add to that, the gigantic literal gaping hole in the earth where the reactor was. This one is a brilliant metaphor of a title, when you consider the dual implication.
How can they know about a "night sky" and not know the stars? I read someone on reddit saying it might be a generational starship and it better not be I'm so sick of that "Lulz they were on a spaceship all along!" crap lately. Either than or it's all in virtual reality. No thanks.
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@celozzip Those theories wouldn't really make sense seeing the drills.
A lot of Star Wars easter eggs but I still say it's the worst so far. And the ones before didn't lay the bar very high.
It's predictable from the get go, it wasn't very funny and yet again I sadly have to point out I can't connect with the character being a teen with teen problems. Which seems to be the thing this season.From the preview picture I hope the next one will be much better.
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@finfan Have you seen the movie, "Sisu?" I think it's from Finland. (And, I really enjoyed it, although IMDb 7.0, it's only six something here.) --think one sequence from, "Inglorious Bastards," fleshed out to a whole movie, but with a very cool Finnish philosophy driving it.
I agree with you about the second set of, "Star Wars Visions," shorts not being as... "inspiring?" For me that first set was kind of magical because I...maybe was having magical thinking -- that they were passion projects, not contracted goods... That they were Anime masters' take on the lore -- fresh viewpoints from the land of, "Akira."
Pretty much another reset with a case probably spanning up to episode nine. There will then be thrown it bits about the murder of Bosch's mother along with one or two new leads or revelations.
Honestly, I don't know if I'm up for four more seasons of this.loading replies
@finfan Season 4 is one of my least favorite seasons, but the next seasons do pick up. For what it's worth, i hear a lot of people's favorite season is 4, so i'm definitely in the minority.
Review by FinFan
More pieces of the puzzle but still no full picture developing.
It actually wasn't too bad. We see more of Q, which is a good thing given deLancies great performance. Concerning Q: Why would he rip himself of his own power in a scenario he himself created ? Doesn't make sense and suggest that someone else is involved ?
So, Laris isn't Laris but a supervisor like Gary Seven. That's an interesting angle that I hope get's further developed than just this short mentioning. I'm also getting some Edith Keeler vibes with Renee Picard in the sense that she was essential for the timeline. Interestingly Keeler's survival would have let probably to the same future as Renee not making the flight. Coincidence ?
The ICE storyline is hopefully done with and it was obviously just there to make a point. Let's leave it at that.
I don't like the Jurati plot because I don't like Jurati. And I'm dissapointed in how they used the Borg Queen so far. But that's just me personally.
Bringing in Brent Spiner as another Soong ancestor is a nice angle that, in a way, gives more depth. Althought I fear he's just a tool here. And Isa Briones finally got to make her appearance in this timeline, too.
One thing that pains me to say a bit is that it feels that Patrick Stewart seems exhausted in almost every scene he's in. It could be intentional in how he plays Picard as a fragile old man. I hope it is because otherwise it would mean it's too much for him. Which could be normal given his age but makes me wonder about his involvement in season 3.
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@finfan You're right, I had forgotten that when the body was made last season, it was mentioned that it would function like an actual human body, no super android strength and other enhancements, that it would even age to Picard's expected life span. Picard had made a comment about this asking if he couldn't have been given 10 more years.
This episode is among the best of the show's whole run.
Not only is it a thrilling cat-and-mouse game between the Enterprise and the Romulans. It shows their commander as much more than just a one-dimensional enemy. He wonders if everything he does makes sense. If there isn't a better way. But he can't escape his drilled in sense of duty. That alone would have make this story stand out. And even Kirk has it's moment showing a little doubt if his decisions are always right. It's basically the question if war is always unavoidable given certain cirsumsatnces, or if it isn't better to avoid it and search for other solutions.
We also have the character of Stiles who openly hates Romulans because his anchestors dies in the war at their hands. When he learns their is a connection to the Vulcans his hatred reflects upon Spock. Stiles only comes around when Spock saves his life despite everything. Yes, it's very on the nose. But for a TV show in the 60s, openly showing that form of bigotry, is exceptional and a reason for Star Trek popularity to this day.
The drama of the young couple supposed to get married at the beginning, with one of them being killed in the line of duty, looses a bit of impact under the weight of everything else. But it leaves us with a final word from Kirk:
"There's always a price to pay"
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@finfan I watched this again (don't click on the spoiler tab if you don't know why) in preparation for the series finale of Star Trek: Strange New Worlds. 6 years passed since I saw this episode. What surprised me is that it was instantly natural to watch it again, like it was yesterday since I watched a previous episode. All my "friends" Kirk, Spock, Bones, Uhura, Scotty, Sulu and others were there waiting for me.
The tension is enormous and I like that we see a psychological battle between two minds that are actually in doubt in their actions. No cocky attitude. Just two men playing chess in space.
Bones dialogue to Kirk is beautiful: "In this galaxy, there's a mathematical probability of three million Earth-type planets. And in all of the universe, three million million galaxies like this. And in all of that... and perhaps more, only one of each of us. Don't destroy the one named Kirk".
I also liked the final confrontation between Kirk and the Romulan commander, I just hoped Kirk replied to him with some compliments.
Technically this was a great episode. But I'm not going to lie, it did nothing for me in terms of story and/or emotions.
I seriously doubt that Gideon is dead. It could go either way but they should not bring him back. He became a weak and cliched villain and, in all ernesty, why do they think they always have to create Vader wannabes ? First Kylo Ren now this. No one will ever come close to Vader.
The whole arc for this season was a two and a half hour movie. At that length you would have had a great pace without all the side stories. Now, where is this all going to go ? Will there be another season ? That's all to be seen. All I can say personally is that I'm not that exciting for another one as I was after season two.
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@finfan Agreed. It was a bit of a retread. Nice action sequences, some humorous droid antics, but less-than overall.
What?? No teaser? No stinger? No giant cliffhanger?
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@the_argentinian There's nothing to milk. Disney+ is subscription based and this series is mainly watched by children, who do not make the financial decisions in the household. On top of that, there are now way too many titles on the service for the end of a single show to make a dent on the subscription count. There's no question that it was first released to pull in subscribers, but now that the service has flourished, the considerable budget it takes to keep this afloat is obviously starting to outweigh whatever perks remain.
